Performance of Gotmatrix 4 popular lists

[ycchen]

UPDATE REPORT ON THE PERFORMANCE of GOTMATRIX.COM 4 MOST POPULAR LISTS (as of Feb. 15, 2004)

See the attached files for the details.

FINDINGS:

1. As I have predicted, all the SIGNUP RATES (per month) dropped significantly after last X'mas. Actually, it was worse than my forecast in Nov 2003.

Example: I forecasted that the signup rate for the PS2 would fall from 47/month in Dec 2003 to 20/month in Feb 04. In reality, it fell from 32/month to 13/month.

2. Due to the worst-than-forecasted signup rate, the WAITING PERIOD of the last person who signed up to get his/her reward INCREASES tremendously.

E.g. Last signup (at position #570) on the Microsoft XBOX list needs to wait for 3048 new signups and (at least) 28.2 years to get his/her XBOX.

3. The waiting period for the 4 lists based on latest signup rate is:
(i) Sony Playstation 2 (PS2) ,17.4 years
(ii) Microsoft XBOX, 28.2 years
(iii) Nintendo Gameboy Advanced,13.3 years
(iv) 42" Plasma TV, 189 years.

4. In short, the signup rate will continue to drop to a near complete halt.

(i.e. 3-5 signups/month for PS2/Xbox/Gameboy and 0-1 signups for Plasma TV in the next 3 months)

If my prediction is correct, the waiting period for all lists will be more than 20 years after May 15, 2004.

5. Will Greg close up shop without refunding his customers? I can't read his mind, but we can be sure that the fall of Gotmatrix will be the closing chapter of the whole pyramid-matrix scam.

[MatrixWatch]

ycchen, your statistics report is a far cry from what Greg recently said:


From: http://www.matrixwatch.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1079&perpage=10&pagenumber=1

Originally posted by Got Matrix

Failing business? Our sales have been increasing every month since starting almost a year ago. Your source for our signups is incorrect or you're making a bad assumption.

If what ycchen has revealed in indeed true, then why would Greg say this?

[ycchen]

Originally posted by Got Matrix Originally
Your source for our signups is incorrect or you're making a bad assumption.

My source comes DIRECTLY from your website. If it is incorrect, then there must be something wrong with your ranking lists!

Bad assumption? I am more than happy if you dare to show me any 'bad assumption' in the report...:)

I am generous enough to show your BEST lists that are still moving. There are many other lists which are simply 'hopeless'. If your best lists take more than 10 years to cycle, how can you dare to tell your new customers that their waiting time is 3-7 months or a year??! :mad:

Now, who is the liar?

[mercinary]

What is the current over-under on how long it will take for gotmatrix to crumble? I want a piece of that action (if anyone is taking bets).

:D

In all seriousness though....you cannot argue with the real numbers. gotmatrix is on its way to collapse (as we all have known forever).

-Merc

[Got Matrix]

If you do a full report on every product you'd know that sales overall were up. Just because 1 or 2 products didn't have many sales doesn't mean sales are down. If you want to do statistics to lead people not to purchase at my site do them right or don't waste your time.

[dwin75]

Sales of what?

[mikv]

If "sales overall" are UP, then why has the cycling stopped?? Im not understanding how Greg would think that he has a successful business when his "most popular" (meaning the only lists that people still buy into) are well within the THOUSANDS to cycle. If you have 30+ lists and only 5 are making minimal sales, you are not up!! You are IN DEBT. Sales are not up, they are stagnating.
If he is making any profit it is definitely straight out of the cycling pool.
He's must be one of those "glass half full" kind of people cause he doesn't see that the glass is half empty.
I've noticed he's opened a couple of new lists, I guess those are what he's taking as being up. Of course you'll get a few signups by offering a new product, but you will stagnate there as well .
The matrix system WILL NOT WORK, because it CANNOT WORK. There is NOT ONE site out there that has proved the matrix concept as a legitimate working business structure because there is no business sense behind the business owners. Plain and simple.

[The Black Pearl]

Sales of what?

Ebooks isn't it?

I'd like an answer from Greg why he hasn't commented on the autocycle fund findings. That thread has been there close to two months and has obviously been ignored.

So what about this Greg? Now that Brdieby is long gone are you going to switch it with some other ponzi scam?

I've helped you out by listing the thread below so you can easily find it. Don't dodge these findings. Explain them.

http://www.matrixwatch.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1000

[MatrixWatch]

Originally posted by Got Matrix
If you want to do statistics to lead people not to purchase at my site do them right or don't waste your time.

The vision for MatrixWatch.org is to provide our members and guests with a detailed analysis of the matrix sites. In doing so, we ask that our members respond to issues surrounding these sites on a point-by-point basis.

For example, a memeber might say, "If A, and B, then C". Another member disagrees and he or she could then say, "A or B is not true because of these facts..., and therefore C is not true." This is standard, beginner's logic 101.

Now Greg, ycchen has made a conclusion based on a statistical example which he compiled based upon data at your site (gotmatrix.com). If you disagree with his conclusions then you need to provide a detailed rebuttal to his statistics. Getting all emotional about it and just saying it isn't true actually lowers the standard of what we are striving for in this dialogue (the truth).

If possible, would you please respond to the statistics that ycchen has gathered? Are they indeed true? If you think he is wrong, then what lists are you willing to provide the data for to support your claim that you are, "doing more business than when you first opened".

It would be fantastic if you could provide a deeper counter-argument. By doing this you would allow the members here to get a better look at how your matrix site works.

It is often said that MatrixWatch.org only shares one side of the story of how the matrix sites work. What really happens is that we present arguments to prove that they are rip-off scams, and then the owners and supporters of these sites cannot present a decent rebuttal to these claims (so they resort to poor arguments and angry accusations). After this happens a few times over, one side of the argument prevails, and it appears that only one side is represented.

Perhaps you could change this on-going cycle by offering some sound argumentation to a few of the challenges that have been launched against GotMatrix (especially from your own customers).

Here is the link for those threads:

http://www.matrixwatch.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=48

[dwin75]

Originally posted by The Black Pearl
Ebooks isn't it?

That being the case, what does this ad suggest?

http://www.gotmatrix.com/promotion/gotmatrix_flyer.pdf

This is fraudulent advertising, and is a tribute to everything that GotMatrix stands for.

Enough said!

[Got Matrix]

Why do you guys even act like I have to prove my statements? I simply come here, post my point, and leave. If I'm going to be rediculed for making statements then why bother coming? You act as if you're a governing force and I have to recon with you, it's time you realize you're normal folk just like myself.

I stated that "sales" are up. People are cycling, that's all that matters! As long as people are cycling then my site has met it's goal.

I have not created any list. I have modified old list to a new gift making it easiar for people to cycle. By changing items to something that's the same price that's obviously more popular I'm helping everyone who has joined the list prior to the change. So far everyone at my site has been very grateful of this business move.

I'm not even going to visit here anymore because I'm the only matrix supporter that even bothers trying to lead you to believe that I'm a good person and I want people to cycle and receive their gifts. Obviously this message cannot be delivered to those of you that have your mine set that it's all doomed in time.

So once again this is my last post, so there's no reason to even ask me another question or post anything for me to read. This has proven to be a lost cause time & time again.

[mercinary]

I think it has been said before, but I will say it again. Greg posting here is admirable. I can see how he would feel personally attacked. BUT, watchdog makes a very good point which cannot be denied. Greg could easily "fend off" us non-believers by countering with some real sign-up data that proves our assumptions wrong.

Greg says above that he is a good person, and wants to help his customers cycle. While I believe that he is a good person, I don't believe he has his customer's in mind everytime he gets another batch of signup $$$. If Greg truely had his customer's as his #1 priority, he would stop taking signups and doing his best to refund / reverse this process.

I personally will miss Greg's posts here, as he is one of the only remaining voices from "the other side". I think that those kind of voices, when spoken intelligently, make matrixwatch a more diverse place.

blah blah blah....I'm done.

-Merc

[Pineapples]

Greg is the owner and he knows the best what's with his site. He doesn't have to prove anything, but there's no way for anyone in here to see his point nor his side of the "truth" to shut people up. If I am not mistaken, Greg is one of those people call matrixwatch a complete lie. After being silent about it, I can't see any lie being said over here at matrixwatch. Afterall, ycchen did a report that sales have been down while Greg claims his sales have been up. In order to prove ycchen is incorrect, Greg needed to step up the plate and give a report of his own, which he failed to do. If he's got nothing to hide, why not prove us wrong?

You can't prove your statements unless you can back it up, that's only fair.

I am surprise Greg said "Why do you guys even act like I have to prove my statements?" Because that is as unprofessional as it gets when it comes to a business owner.

Oh well, that's just my own opinion.

[ycchen]

Originally posted by Got Matrix
If you do a full report on every product you'd know that sales overall were up. Just because 1 or 2 products didn't have many sales doesn't mean sales are down. If you want to do statistics to lead people not to purchase at my site do them right or don't waste your time.

If you think it is waste of time to read anything here, it is also a waste of my time to do statistics on all your mostly stagnant lists. PS2, Gameboy and Xbox have always been your best seller. And the fact that they continue to receive more than 10 signups a month is quite impressive compare to other dead or near dead matrix-sites. Unfortunatly, you can not deny the fact that their sale are all DECLINING rapidly!

The second fact that you cannot deny is that it takes more than 10 years for the newbie to cycle. If you are such an honest and caring owner, why do you continue to take newbies' money KNOWING that they will have to wait for more than 10 years to cycle??? What kind of honest busniess man are you??? I am speechless.

Okay, if you think you know your matrix better than I do, let us know those lists that have growing SALE since Nov 2003! Let us know those wonderful and magical lists to prove you point!! If you can't give us lists that are growing, then how can you prove that the OVERALL SALES is increasing?? There should be MANY LISTS (not just one or two lists) increasing since Nov 2003 to OFFSET the decrease of the 4 most popular lists, right?

Again, I don't expect any reply from you cause you NEVER response to any of my statistical challenge, so I will just leave it to the forum members to decide: 'who is lying.'

[The Black Pearl]

I thought Greg had good intentions until I looked at the auto-cycle fund methods. That changed my mind. I am also questioning the fact that he has failed to explain any of it. It's like he sees every thread in the GotMatrix folder except for that.

I would say the reason why he hasn't explained the auto-cycle methods is because he has no recourse. The reason he won't explain his overall sales increases is probably for the same reason. He couldn't get out of his hole now if he tried. The point of no return was crossed a long time ago.

[ycchen]

Yes, you had done a good job in your investigation on Gotmatrix autocycle fund! As usual, Greg don't dare to respond to any serious challenge.

Update on Autocycle Fund:
It was $330 in Nov 2003
It is now $530 in Feb. 2004

Conclusion: Gotmatrix autocycle fund is a JOKE that has ZERO (or near zero) effect on cycling any lists. :mad:

The Black Pearl, you know why Greg can confidently ignore any of our investigations? That is because any serious challenge in this forum will not affect his business. Why? Because he can continue to scam misinformed newbies from OTHER online sources. The percentage of newbies coming to MW to learn about matrix scam before they invest is pretty low, I suspect.

However, if any newbies do come to MW, I am 100% confident that they will not put a dime in any of these DISHONEST pyramid-matrix scheme!

Asymmetric information is how scammer like Greg, Karen or all those pyramid-matrix owners can survive today! But not for long ..:)

[MatrixWatch]

Originally posted by Got Matrix
Why do you guys even act like I have to prove my statements?

You act as if you're a governing force and I have to recon with you, it's time you realize you're normal folk just like myself.

So far everyone at my site has been very grateful of this business move.

I'm not even going to visit here anymore ...

.... there's no reason to even ask me another question or post anything for me to read.

Question: What do Cult leaders and internet scammers have in common?

Answer: They both get very emotional and pissed off when people start asking honest questions. All the while they make the person asking questions feel guilty for doing so, while also puffing up their own image in the site of others.

Greg does exactly this. He tells up that all his customers are happy, and that he is such a great guy. He also says that we are just "normal folk" and I guess that means that we are not entitled to know the truth.

Notice that his last post is a complete smoke screen. He attacks us for asking very important questions. Questions that are aimed at determining whether or not his customers are getting a fair deal. He also makes it look like he is our victim, and that he isn't going to come here anymore as a result. This is not true. What is really happening is the Greg is creating an EXIT door for himself so he doesn't have to answer our questions about the matrix anymore. On his own forum he can ignore and delete posts that contain important questions, but here he cannot do that. We have very basic questions to ask, and we have statistics to back up the claims we are making. If we are lying, as Greg says we are, then he needs to show us where we are mistaken.

Still, he stands by his statement that more people are signing up and cycling than ever before, but our research has not verified his claim. We ask about it, and he gets defensive.

Folks, this is a bad sign. Someone is going to end up filing a chargeback, telling others how to do it also, and GotMatrix will vanish after being beaten down with extra fees. This is not good for the customers stuck on a list who are not keeping up with current events. Greg should begin working out a refund plan, or the customers should look into their class-action options by contacting a lawyer. But if things continue to progress as they have been, then there will be some very upset people in the near future, and the whole affair will not end as smoothly as it can if something were to be done soon.

We here at MatrixWatch.org are just as concerned about the customers are GotMatrix claims to be. That is why we don't want any more people to get sucked into that fraudulent scam. We have no financial stake in the advice we give, but Greg has a huge financial interest in keeping the "image" of GotMatrix up in the air. For that reason, we encourage the customers to start asking Greg some very important questions.

[concerned]

Originally posted by watchdog
Question: What do Cult leaders and internet scammers have in common?

There is another similarity that I remember from back when I was reading the Gotmatrix forums. You would often see members constantly make posts about how important it was to VOTE, as if that ever made a real difference. I bet they still do that today. The key though, was that they make the customers feel that they deserve to get scammed if they don't participate by making them "VOTE" and "ADVERTISE". If that behavior isn't cult like, then what is?

[ycchen]

Originally posted by mercinary
I think it has been said before, but I will say it again. Greg posting here is admirable. I can see how he would feel personally attacked. BUT, watchdog makes a very good point which cannot be denied. Greg could easily "fend off" us non-believers by countering with some real sign-up data that proves our assumptions wrong.

Greg says above that he is a good person, and wants to help his customers cycle. While I believe that he is a good person, I don't believe he has his customer's in mind everytime he gets another batch of signup $$$. If Greg truely had his customer's as his #1 priority, he would stop taking signups and doing his best to refund / reverse this process.

I personally will miss Greg's posts here, as he is one of the only remaining voices from "the other side". I think that those kind of voices, when spoken intelligently, make matrixwatch a more diverse place.

blah blah blah....I'm done.

-Merc

Merc, I agree with you that any forum with diverse opinion is always good. Let's hope that Greg can make more intelligient arguement like Damion did before.

I am afriad that he cannot make any rational arguement on any of our claims because of two reasons.
First, he knows that our statistics and investigations are correct, so I know he has nothing to say except by diverting attention or run away from it.

Second, he did not keep a good record of his own signup data therefore he honestly does not know the monthly signup rate for each lists. Instead, I did the job for him by keeping the record of monthly signup rate of the whole gotmatrix. Do you know why he did not keep that record? The answer is very simple, he DID NOT CARE!!! If he keep the record of the signup rate per month, then he will not be able to explain to his customer why the signup rate keep DROPING. As a greedy owners, his only concern is total SALES because he can get 20-50% profit out of the total sales.

In short, only customer care about signup rate, declining signuprate means that your wait will be forever. The owner care only about how much he can earn from the total sales. So, a PROFIT ORIENTED owner like Greg will only care about the overall sales, but not signup rate of each lists because if he knows that he might need to show them to his customers (like I did for him) . If he did that, he will only scare his customer away.

That is why I do not even bother to get his genuine response because he DOES NOT have the data to make counter arguement... What a pathetic, selfish and irresponsible owner who shamelessly claimed to be the 'customer-first' owner :mad:

To be fair, all profit-first (in contrast to customer-first) pyramid-matrix owners act the same, so Greg is not worst than the rest. In fact, he did pay customer as fast as he could. I will give credit to him on this consistant committment, even though scamming money from newbies to pay himself and oldies is a truly unethical business.