Has Anyone Just Asked for a Refund??

[busycl]

I wondered if anyone has really tried to get a refund by emailing Kim and just asking with any success? I have been reading these threads and I know some people have gotten refunds such as swishnev, but by making their voices heard publicly on the forums and getting enough heat for it to get a refund. I don’t feel like doing that, but I am going to try to email Kim and simply ask. Does anyone have Kim’s personal email for me or another email where I will get a reply (maybe)? If you could pm me I would appreciate it. Forget the helpdesk I won’t get an answer there. :shake:


Thanks :)

Busycl

[swishnev]

i didn't set out to get a refund, it just happened. i had questions that i wanted answers to that they wouldn't answer. i would just like the record set straight on that. i never asked for, nor demanded a refund. i was willing to walk away with nothing. go to the help desk and put attention kim at the top of your submitted ticket, that is the only way i know to contact him. i think others have attempted to just ask for a refund and have been unsuccessful thus far.

[swishnev]

i just re-read what i wrote. it wasn't meant to sound mean, i apologize if it did

[Shoes]

I saw your questions in the ymforum Swishnev and in my opinion they were answered adequately.

With respect, you were just not happy with the answers given - that's the truth.

[concerned]

I saw your questions in the ymforum Swishnev and in my opinion they were answered adequately.

With respect, you were just not happy with the answers given - that's the truth.


I wouldn't be happy either if the questions were answered truthfully. Who enjoys being told that they were most likely going to be scammed?

[Shoes]

Strange reply!! Is everything discussed in here under the 'scam' banner then?

Are you an official on this site?

[ComplexKid]

In one of the threads in here, it seems a couple of people did ask for refunds--the result was either a flat-out 'no', or Kim said if they sent in all kinds of identification he would attempt to sell their positions for them.

It appears the only successful refunds are the ones that have gone to people who got booted.

Scary. So many people I know are already hurting from this one, and are going to be hurting way worse when it does completely crash and burn.

[Train]

Kim's personal email is president@ymmss.org

[Gringo]

Strange reply!! Is everything discussed in here under the 'scam' banner then?
Truthful reply, and yes if you follow the heading for this topic you will find it located in the "other internet scams" heading.

[busycl]

Thanks for the replies :)

swishnev, No worries I didn't take your reply as rude....I would....am feeling the same way. No answers unbelieveable :shake: I didn't loose my life savings or anything...I just thought that if he started to do it that there might be a chance that he might give out a few more :rolleyes: if I stated that I knew that there were people that received refunds (not mentioning any names though) I guess I will try it what the heck ;)

Thanks again :cool:

[surfer]

Welcome to MatrixWatch Busycl.

I have heard/read of a couple others
getting refunds, but it seems that
they apply the rules pretty inconsistently.

I've said it a couple times already, but
I feel that anyone who joined when Kim
was making either the 60-90 day guarantee
or was telling them he had special reserve
funds set aside to keep cycle times under
90 days should be able to get their money
back no questions asked.

It would be the moral and ethical thing to
do.

[bowmaker]

I saw your questions in the ymforum Swishnev and in my opinion they were answered adequately.

With respect, you were just not happy with the answers given - that's the truth.


thats weird , i saw most of his questions get deleted . i wouldnt be happy with that answer either.

[swishnev]

Shoes, what you didn't see in the ymforum were the questions I sent to the help desk and kim himself. in return they sent me links of threads on the message boards while saying at the same time those threads were not entirely consistent with the ym administrations thinking and should be taken as such. i sent kim an email asking for the retention rate of members and he told me they didn't keep numbers for that so he wasn't sure, even though it would be easy to calculate for most businesses. trust me, the questions i asked in the forums were just a few of the questions i asked overall. also, questions answered in the forums by other members do not always generate "correct" answers and are more like to generate answers on how someone feels. you are allowed your opinion and i respect that, but when you speak for me "you were just not happy with the answers given - that's the truth" you are incorrect. I was unhappy with the thousands of people who put money into ymmss with the understanding of getting a return on it in the 60-90 day timeframe. I, myself, only used a little bit of my disposable income while some of the members used money they needed to pay bills and live a healthy life. This scared me because I could see where YMMSS was going based on the math and the answers I was, or wasn't, receiving. We are all human, and to sit there and know people are losing "their shirts" in YMMSS concerned me much more than getting my money back.

[drzod]

I tried simply asking for a refund. I was told that YMMSS does not give refunds (as the membership agreement states), but that if I were to complete some convoluted process (which by the way requires you to release more of your personal information), that they could sell your positions. No one could explain this process to me. I do not need my positions sold; I just want a refund of my original investment.

[drzod]

Ok, I finally posted something to YMforums.com. It is listed below:

As of 06/29/05 (yesterday) the cycle time is 249 days. This means that commissions are being processed for 10/23/04 (06/29/05 - 249 days).

If you joined after 10/23/04 you have never cycled.

Has anyone considered giving a refund to those members who feel they cannot wait until cycle times decline? I know the membership agreement states that there are no refunds, but this seems like it would be a great move on management's part to stop the postings in regards to cycle time.

I am going to post the same to the gold, silver, and general forums. Nothing nasty or rude, just this simple request.

[swishnev]

drzod i believe you will get a quick response from the ym admin on that one.

[drzod]

Swishnev, I hope so. Like you, I am looking for answers to tough questions that is all. If they would change their policy of no refunds it would go a long way to proving YMMSS was legit. Until that day, I must side with the members of this forum.

(Of course we all know the reason for the no refund policy - just read the threads here)

[drzod]

Well, it's 7:50 am. EST, and I can no longer log into YMMSS on the client side. I cannot tell if this means that I have been kicked out, or that the site is having problems.

I have also noticed that my post concerning refunds under ymforums.com, About YMMSS - English, subject - Will I Ever Cycle Again, has been removed and replaced with a line from everyone' favorite moderator Alan: "Please use the affiliate areas for your YMMSS related inquiries - Alan."

I also cannot log on to ymforums.com with the ID and password I created on 06/28/05. Once again, my post is listed below:

As of 06/29/05 (yesterday) the cycle time is 249 days. This means that commissions are being processed for 10/23/04 (06/29/05 - 249 days).

If you joined after 10/23/04 you have never cycled.

Has anyone considered giving a refund to those members who feel they cannot wait until cycle times decline? I know the membership agreement states that there are no refunds, but this seems like it would be a great move on management's part to stop the postings in regards to cycle time.


Since the e-mail address I used for YMMSS is my home address, I will have to wait until after work to see what is going on.

[surfer]

The site is down for processing drzod.

After today, they won't process until Tuesday
because of the July 4th holiday. Supposedly
they will try to do it without taking the site
down.

Microsoft issues are being blamed for the need
to take the site offline for processing.

[drzod]

The site was up at 7:45 a.m. (EST), but I still cannot get in. It looks like Alan has evicted me. Maybe he has some residual anger from not being able to ramble on about nothing on this site.

[drzod]

I am not sure if this is just coincidence, but last night I received an e-mail at home (the e-mail address tied to YMMSS) from Intgold stating that funds have been transferred to my account. I checked the balance, and YMMSS has credited my refund of $370. No e-mail with an explanation was given, but I find it interesting that this occurred after being told I was not getting a refund due to posts here, and after listing myself on the victim's list started by Mercinary.

Thoughts?

[ycchen]

Congrats, drzod. As an obvious ponzi scam, YMMSS is vulnerable to massive complaint filed by victims to multiple authorities. If they are not ponzi, they shouldn't worry about any complaint at all, right? ;)

Since the YMMSS ponzi had already collapsed (moving from the doubler ponzi to something else has said it all.), Kim and his gangs are trying very hard to wipe out the trace of their old ponzi system (garantee cycle in 60-90 days, forever!).

Therefore, it is a golden time for victims to come forward and file as many complaints as possible to stop this ponzi from hurting more people. I am sure a ponzi of this size will get attention of one authority eventually.

[surfer]

I think it shows that this site is getting
the job done.

Frankly, I don't view it as a refund at all.

It's more of a discounted payment for
services rendered.

You worked as an independent contractor
for over a year and YMMSS was several
months late in paying you what you
recently earned under your original contract
(60-90 day cycle times).

They got off easy since you were supposed
to be at about 4 times your account balance
when you were terminated.

Good for you drzod. :applause:

[Salsa]

That's great news, DrZod. And I think the reason for your refund is right here (http://www.matrixwatch.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2969). Once refunded, your complaint isn't going to carry the same weight that it did before. So YMMSS is just trying to mitigate damages.

An additional possibility is that esto may have interceded for you after learning your story. A commonality I'd noticed between previous refunds (but failed to mention) was that esto had interceded on refunded members' behalf. For those who hadn't gotten requested refunds, however, I hadn't noticed their mentioning any discussions with esto.

Salsa
__________

Afterthought: If a pattern does develop where members posting their official complaints here do get refunds, that could backfire on YMMSS the same way that kicking out and refunding the "troublemaker" swishnev did. It will only server to increase members' motivation to file formal complaints and post them here.

-S

[Arzel]

I am not sure if this is just coincidence, but last night I received an e-mail at home (the e-mail address tied to YMMSS) from Intgold stating that funds have been transferred to my account. I checked the balance, and YMMSS has credited my refund of $370. No e-mail with an explanation was given, but I find it interesting that this occurred after being told I was not getting a refund due to posts here, and after listing myself on the victim's list started by Mercinary.

Thoughts?

Good news DrZod.

I know you filed a formal complaint, I suggest you notify the agencies involved that you have recieved a refund from YMMSS.

This will serve two purposes. YMMSS won't be able to come back ad say anything about meritless complaints, and by stating all your steps (including steps taken here) you should bring a little more attention to YMMSS indirectly. YMMSS is getting worried, this is just more evidence to that cause.

[drzod]

I just informed both the NC AG and the SEC of my full refund.

I will continue to watch with interest the comments posted by Esto and the reponses - it's better than any reality TV show out there!

<Edit>

Mercinary, do you wish to leave me on the victims list?

[swishnev]

so drzod you finally got a refund??

[drzod]

Swishnev, my Intgold account was credited, but I am having "fun" trying to up my verification score at Intgold to withdraw my funds.

Wish me luck!

[drzod]

Back on 01/05/04 I used $400 to join YMMSS/STA.

Remember I chose to repurchase EPC's and never got paid.

Before I got kicked out my commissions earned were $5,920 with my upcoming commissions (still would be waiting to cycle) of $11,840.

Shortly after getting kicked out and Esto showing up here $370 was refunded to me (the amount I "invested" in YMMSS).

After fees and the $11 payment to my sponsor, I got back $350.93. :)

As a result, I lost $49.07 to YMMSS.

At least I recouped 87.7% of my original "investment."

I wonder if they are still claiming that no one has lost any money?

[Leonidas]

I'm sure the total commissions paid still includes your $5,920 that is supposed to be real money, but as in your example, it obviously isn't.

L

[mechanic]

Back on 01/05/04 I used $400 to join YMMSS/STA.

Remember I chose to repurchase EPC's and never got paid.

Before I got kicked out my commissions earned were $5,920 with my upcoming commissions (still would be waiting to cycle) of $11,840.

Shortly after getting kicked out and Esto showing up here $370 was refunded to me (the amount I "invested" in YMMSS).

After fees and the $11 payment to my sponsor, I got back $350.93. :)

As a result, I lost $49.07 to YMMSS.

At least I recouped 87.7% of my original "investment."

I wonder if they are still claiming that no one has lost any money?

That is weird that you were charged those fee's,when I recieved my refund,every cent was returned to my stormpay account with no fees whatever deducted. It was listed on my stormpay as a refund from YMMSS.
They must have changed the wording for the fee's to be assesed.
Layton

[drzod]

The interesting thing is that the debit to my IntGold account said that it included the fees etc.

Oh well, I would rather lose $49 than $400.

My sponsor is still a firm believer.

I sent this to him last Thursday:

Are you still a believer? With cycle times at 341 days and a new system to pay anywhere from $0.60 to $3.00 a share, I'm glad I got out when I did with only losing $49.00.

He replies:

I haven't lost any money yet. Last week another $960 was deposited into my IntGold account.

So naturally, I send:

Great! I'll give you my IntGold account so you can send me about $60 so I can break even.

Of course I have not received a response.