Thoughts about ymmss

[Dreamer]

The forums at YM are full of nothing but chit-chat and drivel now that we have all been effectively muzzled by watching others be muzzled.

I hope that the Retailers Ad Site and the new payment plan is a success because I feel so sorry for all of my friends who have maxed out credit cards for $30,000, taken down 401ks for $15,000, sold stocks for $30,000, used their retirement funds for $50,000 to "purchase a product" from YM. That "product" being "advertising". These are just my friends. The forums used to be full of people with horror stories, but they don't want to hear horror stories. They only want to hear fairy tales over there.

"IF" YM is brought down and prosecuted, there will be NO recourse for the poor people who have "invested" their money. They don't like the word "invest" over there either. So, in my opinion, I hope YM is NOT brought down and prosecuted, that the retailers will run ads on the new retail web site, because that is the only way that those who have been deceived and lured in will be able to get their money back, and hopefully wont commit suicide like some of the people over at IT4US.

The reason they will NEVER get their money back if YM is prosecuted is because the business is in another country, and the money is in a swiss bank account where the banks are NOT subject to u.s. banking laws. Maybe if you just let this rest a while and give it a chance, it could actually get some money back to the people who are suffering. OF COURSE, that wont stop new victims from being lured in.

When I joined YM I was NEVER told it was an advertising business. I was told "Your money will double in 90 days". That is what I was told, that is what we were all told. That is why we joined. At least now they are saying "there is no guarantee you will make any money, and join at your own risk" per Esto. They should have said that at the beginning. Every other scam I am in right now has right on the sign-up page, "there is no guarantee you will make any money, it is all dependent on the markets and how many people join". One of the scams I am in actually says on their sign-up page - "We are NOT subject to SEC or U.S. authorities".

I never started joining scams until I saw YM going down the tubes, then I got desperate and was trying to make a little money to tide myself over until YM recovered. I only hope and pray for all the victims that it can recover and get going with the new payment plan. You wonder - "why does he keep hoping when it is OBVIOUS what is going on". That is the nature of this kind of thing. We stay in denial until we hit bottom, and then maybe even then we don't come out of denial. Reality is Not Pleasant. That is why we go into denial. Maybe if there was some way you all could get back to the facts and figures, it would help. When you sling mud at YM we become protective. That is part of the cult mentality. Just because I can see the group psychology doesnt mean I am any more able to extract myself from it than the other fairy tale spinners over there. I see what is going on, but there is no way out, so we all continue to wait and hope and pray. 3 of my friends are having nervous breakdowns over this - (symptoms = fear, crying, etc)

[happy]

Dreamer,

I hope the people on this site take your advice and leave YM alone for awhile and see what happens with the new system. I think I'm seeing a little change in the tone of your posts. Have you decided that the new system might have a chance. :)
I'm just curious. How is it that you were never told that YM was an advertising business. When did you joined didn't your sponsor ever mention advertising? I joined in 2004 and I certainly knew that it was an advertising business. I was told right from the beginning that YM would be getting into the retail ad business. That is what makes me believe that YM has a good chance of being a long term business. That is what sold me.
Please don't take my question as anything other than curiosity.

[surfer]

Very sorry to hear about the problems for you
and your friends Dreamer.

I would love to see the retail side be a success
as well, but I don't intend to forget the manner
in which Kim Inman lied to people and made false
promises and guarantees.

I don't think that Matrix Watch itself is doing much
to bring down YMMSS. It is simply a place where
those who were lied to can find info on filing their
own complaints if that's the direction they want to
head.

Kim's documented history of lying and hype hurts
YMMSS more than MW does. If he hadn't made
such irresponsible claims and launched a ponzi,
there would be no YMMSS forums here. Of course,
he also wouldn't have made the millions he has
from this scheme.

Money from the retail side is supposed to start
pouring in by the end of September, so we'll see
what that brings.

Good luck to you and your friends Dreamer. You
guys will be on my mind daily.

@ happy

YMMSS was promoted primarily as a doubler
where you had to send and read ads in order
to get paid.

If this was not the case, they would not be
so prevalent on sites like TalkGold, MMG,
HYIPDiscussion. etc.

Also, Kim routinely refered to EPC purchases
as investments early on in his marketing of
YMMSS.

For the majority, the best that they could
ever hope for would be that YMMSS will be
a nice short term investment. Because of
the inevitable dilution of shares that will
occur, it will cost more than it's worth to
make your "dream income" from YMMSS
returns.

Trying to earn a full time living with YMMSS
will be like trying to earn a full time income
from investment dividends.

[Salsa]

The forums at YM are full of nothing but chit-chat and drivel now that we have all been effectively muzzled by watching others be muzzled.

I hope that the Retailers Ad Site and the new payment plan is a success because I feel so sorry for all of my friends who have maxed out credit cards for $30,000, taken down 401ks for $15,000, sold stocks for $30,000, used their retirement funds for $50,000 to "purchase a product" from YM. That "product" being "advertising". These are just my friends. The forums used to be full of people with horror stories, but they don't want to hear horror stories. They only want to hear fairy tales over there.

"IF" YM is brought down and prosecuted, there will be NO recourse for the poor people who have "invested" their money. They don't like the word "invest" over there either. So, in my opinion, I hope YM is NOT brought down and prosecuted, that the retailers will run ads on the new retail web site, because that is the only way that those who have been deceived and lured in will be able to get their money back, and hopefully wont commit suicide like some of the people over at IT4US.

The reason they will NEVER get their money back if YM is prosecuted is because the business is in another country, and the money is in a swiss bank account where the banks are NOT subject to u.s. banking laws. Maybe if you just let this rest a while and give it a chance, it could actually get some money back to the people who are suffering. OF COURSE, that wont stop new victims from being lured in.

When I joined YM I was NEVER told it was an advertising business. I was told "Your money will double in 90 days". That is what I was told, that is what we were all told. That is why we joined. At least now they are saying "there is no guarantee you will make any money, and join at your own risk" per Esto. They should have said that at the beginning. Every other scam I am in right now has right on the sign-up page, "there is no guarantee you will make any money, it is all dependent on the markets and how many people join". One of the scams I am in actually says on their sign-up page - "We are NOT subject to SEC or U.S. authorities".

I never started joining scams until I saw YM going down the tubes, then I got desperate and was trying to make a little money to tide myself over until YM recovered. I only hope and pray for all the victims that it can recover and get going with the new payment plan. You wonder - "why does he keep hoping when it is OBVIOUS what is going on". That is the nature of this kind of thing. We stay in denial until we hit bottom, and then maybe even then we don't come out of denial. Reality is Not Pleasant. That is why we go into denial. Maybe if there was some way you all could get back to the facts and figures, it would help. When you sling mud at YM we become protective. That is part of the cult mentality. Just because I can see the group psychology doesnt mean I am any more able to extract myself from it than the other fairy tale spinners over there. I see what is going on, but there is no way out, so we all continue to wait and hope and pray. 3 of my friends are having nervous breakdowns over this - (symptoms = fear, crying, etc)Is this your own story, Dreamer, or are you posting a quote for someone else? While I can empathize with every word (I have one family member with six figures lost to YMMSS), it doesn't quite sound like the Dreamer who I've come to know at Matrix Watch. Will you please clarify the inspiration for your post?

Salsa
____________

[AvidA]

Dreamer,

I hope the people on this site take your advice and leave YM alone for awhile and see what happens with the new system. I think I'm seeing a little change in the tone of your posts. Have you decided that the new system might have a chance. :)
I'm just curious. How is it that you were never told that YM was an advertising business. When did you joined didn't your sponsor ever mention advertising? I joined in 2004 and I certainly knew that it was an advertising business. I was told right from the beginning that YM would be getting into the retail ad business. That is what makes me believe that YM has a good chance of being a long term business. That is what sold me.
Please don't take my question as anything other than curiosity.

Hello, Happy!

I joined in 2003 before Esto did. And, no, I was never told that it was a retail ad business. Just that I could retire within 18 months after doubling my money. I am mathematically challenged :rolleyes: so, I didn't stop to think of the ramifications of such nonsense and I acted too quickly. I have hope that I will get my INVESTMENT back from the new system...and I also have hope that it will work. But I still rely on the voices here because they're good at math and common sense. It will keep me from going overboard ever again.

[AvidA]

Is this your own story, Dreamer, or are you posting a quote for someone else? While I can empathize with every word (I have one family member with six figures lost to YMMSS), it doesn't quite sound like the Dreamer who I've come to know at Matrix Watch. Will you please clarify the inspiration for your post?

Salsa
____________

I agree, Salsa. This is so sentimental for the Dreamer I've been reading from for the past 4 months. :eek:

[happy]

Hello, Happy!

I joined in 2003 before Esto did. And, no, I was never told that it was a retail ad business. Just that I could retire within 18 months after doubling my money. I am mathematically challenged :rolleyes: so, I didn't stop to think of the ramifications of such nonsense and I acted too quickly. I have hope that I will get my INVESTMENT back from the new system...and I also have hope that it will work. But I still rely on the voices here because they're good at math and common sense. It will keep me from going overboard ever again.

Hello to you too AvidA!!
Interesting that the retail side wasn't mentioned earlier, maybe that was part of the evolution!
I hope you get your money back and then some. Hang in there and lets see how the new system goes.
Happy :)

[swishnev]

happy, how can you be so optimistic about the new system when the old system failed so badly for so many people?

[happy]

Well Swish,
I think that the changes are for the better and I hope to see everyone who is upset now get there money back although it may take a little time. Then they can go on their way and stop all of the grumbling. And this section of Matrix Watch will disappear. I don't have any facts and figures to back up my feelings about the new system (but then you all don't have any either) I don't feel betrayed by Kim or angry with YM. The new system is not exactly what I would like but I'm okay with it and I think it's being changed for the right reasons, not just to keep what you say is a "scam" going a little longer. I feel it will turn around and become a good thing. Change is good. There have been a lot of bumps in the road. It may take some more changes and thats okay. I hope the unhappy members will see their rewards.
And all of you naysayers out there with your facts and figures, please don't start jumping all over me. I've read your figures and seen your graphs and I've seen your point of view. The old system was not working well, but the new system can. So I'm willing to let it work. Anyone who is not satisfied to wait, I'm real sorry about that but when you put money into a business(internet or otherwise) you are taking a chance. There are few 100% guarantees in this world no matter what anyone says.
And I hope that the ex-members like you Swish aren't sorry for getting out.
Happy :)

[Arzel]

Well Swish,
I think that the changes are for the better and I hope to see everyone who is upset now get there money back although it may take a little time. Then they can go on their way and stop all of the grumbling. And this section of Matrix Watch will disappear. I don't have any facts and figures to back up my feelings about the new system (but then you all don't have any either) I don't feel betrayed by Kim or angry with YM. The new system is not exactly what I would like but I'm okay with it and I think it's being changed for the right reasons, not just to keep what you say is a "scam" going a little longer. I feel it will turn around and become a good thing. Change is good. There have been a lot of bumps in the road. It may take some more changes and thats okay. I hope the unhappy members will see their rewards.
And all of you naysayers out there with your facts and figures, please don't start jumping all over me. I've read your figures and seen your graphs and I've seen your point of view. The old system was not working well, but the new system can. So I'm willing to let it work. Anyone who is not satisfied to wait, I'm real sorry about that but when you put money into a business(internet or otherwise) you are taking a chance. There are few 100% guarantees in this world no matter what anyone says.
And I hope that the ex-members like you Swish aren't sorry for getting out.
Happy :)

Happy,

How can you be happy with a person that 100% guarentees no one will ever loose anything with YMMSS, and that everyone will double their money in 90 days or less, and yet say "There are few 100% guarantees in this world no matter what anyone says". I must ask you why?

How can you make that statement, and not be upset with Kim? YMMSS LIED to you, YMMSS LIED to everyone. YMMSS will continue to LIE.

How does that old saying go. "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me." You are now on the twice part.

[happy]

Arzel,
I didn't say that I was happy that my money didn't keep doubling every 90 days.
As of this moment I have not "lost" my money and neither has anyone else. Theres still an opportunity to get it back...it's not gone and neither is YM. If YM were non existent then I would say its lost. I am not upset with YM, I don't feel I was lied too. At the time I joined (I can only speak for myself) my money did double. Then things changed. I guess some people see this as lying, I don't.
I think things changed with YM not because Kim or anyone else involved wanted them too or intended them too but because it had to to survive. And it has survived. Maybe things were not handled perfectly but perhaps that area will improve. They have new people and new ideas and I'm going to ride it out and let them do their job.
Happy :)

[swishnev]

happy, even if ymmss somehow turns it around and all members become millionaires i won't be sorry about what happened. i do not and would not want to be associated with a company like ymmss, simple as that.

[happy]

Okay Swishnev, fair enough. Ciao.

[Arzel]

Happy,

Did, does YMMSS guarentee that NO ONE will lose any money when you joined?

Did you say that their are no 100% guarentees, to those complaining about YMMSS?

Do you not see the irony in your statements?

Exactly how long do you give YMMSS to give you back your initial investment. One year, two years, five years?

I know you don't like to believe this, but most people will NEVER get back their original investment. Because YMMSS is a ponzi the primary source of money has been other members, therefore no real money has come from outside sources.

If one is to believe YMMSS CPA amounts of $100 million paid out, then YMMSS members are at least $25 million short of just being able to get their own money back. At the current rate it will be a year minimum before the average member today gets back their initial investment, and unless Kim somehow pulls off the miricle $19 million a week (which no sane person believes) that money will be coming from even later uniformed investors.

Why are you so willing to believe someone that has lied to you time and time again, versus someone like me that has NO INTEREST in ever recieving a dime from you or anyone else that visits this forum. I spend my own money to help support this forum to warn people about scams, and still people don't want to believe......

[happy]

Happy,

Did, does YMMSS guarentee that NO ONE will lose any money when you joined?

I believe it was stated that no one HAS lost any money. I don't recall that being a guarantee.

Did you say that their are no 100% guarentees, to those complaining about YMMSS?
I did state that there are FEW 100% guarantees in this world referring to putting money into any business.

Do you not see the irony in your statements?

No, I do not

Exactly how long do you give YMMSS to give you back your initial investment. One year, two years, five years?

Of course I would prefer it to be one year. Actually I would prefer it to be tomorrow!!!!!. But I'll wait as long as I have to.

I know you don't like to believe this, but most people will NEVER get back their original investment.

That still remains to be seen. Can you guarantee this 100%!!! :D


Why are you so willing to believe someone that has lied to you time and time again, versus someone like me that has NO INTEREST in ever recieving a dime from you or anyone else that visits this forum. I spend my own money to help support this forum to warn people about scams, and still people don't want to believe......

I don't feel that I've been lied to. Lying is when someone is intentionally not telling the truth and I don't feel that is what has happened with YM.

Happy :)

[concerned]

Lying is when someone is intentionally not telling the truth and I don't feel that is what has happened with YM.

Happy :)


So, please explain, if Kim did not INTENTIONALLY tell a lie about doubling money every 90 days, then where did he think he was going to get all the money to double forever? Does he have a money tree orchard somewhere?

[Arzel]

I don't feel that I've been lied to. Lying is when someone is intentionally not telling the truth and I don't feel that is what has happened with YM.

Happy :)

How about the fact that Kim stated directly that profits from the Belieze resort were being put into the CPA when we now find that is not true?

Or that the Belieze resort had been purchased, only to find out now months later that it is in the process of being purchases.

[concerned]

Or that the Belieze resort had been purchased, only to find out now months later that it is in the process of being purchases.

But Arzel, that isn't INTENTIONAL because he really thought he had already bought it. :)

[happy]

How about the fact that Kim stated directly that profits from the Belieze resort were being put into the CPA when we now find that is not true?

As far as I know, there are no profits yet from the Belize resort. No profits = no money into the CPA. When the resort shows a profit then I expect it will go into the CPA.. If I find out differently thats when it will be an issue.

Or that the Belieze resort had been purchased, only to find out now months later that it is in the process of being purchases.

I have not heard this before. I can't comment because I do not know if its true or not.

[happy]

So, please explain, if Kim did not INTENTIONALLY tell a lie about doubling money every 90 days, then where did he think he was going to get all the money to double forever?

Sorry I can't answer a question about what Kim thought. I'm not him.

Does he have a money tree orchard somewhere?

I don't know if he has one in his back yard or not but some of people in this forum who like to drive by his house may know. Just kidding! :) If he does I'd like a cutting.!

[Arzel]

I have not heard this before. I can't comment because I do not know if its true or not.

I don't have the time to find the specific comments here, but it is a fact that for months Kim stated that profits from the resort were going into the CPA. Recently, when pressed about the amount from the resort, he stated that there have been no profits and wouldn't be for at least the rest of this year. If you have listened to the conference calls you would know this to be true.

When asked last Thursday who is the owner of the resort Kim stated that it is the process of being purchased by a party through the bank of Belieze (or something like that, don't have the exact quote in front of me), you can listen to the conference call yourself and hear what he has to say. Someone here sent a note to Fred Good (previous owner) to find out who is the current owner. Mr. Good stated it had been sold and he didn't wish to divulge who the new owner was. Some time last year Kim stated that YMMSS had purchased the resort in Belieze (Surfer or someone can you remember when that was?). Earlier this spring during a Monday or Tuesday conference call Jim or Berry stated that Kim had purchased the resort in Belieze, and that profits from the resort were going into the CPA. Kim has made a similar statement numerous times on Thursday call.

Someone is lying. Either Kim is lying about having purchased the resort earlier, or he is lying about it being in the process of being purchased. Mr. Good has no reason to lie about having sold it. Jim and Berry are just stating what they are told by Kim or Mark.

This is just one thing Happy. Do your research, you will find numerous items where Kim has said one thing, only to later find out what he said and what actually happened are different.

[concerned]

I like your excuses. Since you never heard those specific comments, he still didn't lie. Good logic.

[happy]

I don't have the time to find the specific comments here, but it is a fact that for months Kim stated that profits from the resort were going into the CPA. Recently, when pressed about the amount from the resort, he stated that there have been no profits and wouldn't be for at least the rest of this year. If you have listened to the conference calls you would know this to be true.

Arzel, This is not what I said I hadn't heard before. I do listen to the conference calls. I know this is true. I'm the one who said there were no profits in the post you are replying to.

When asked last Thursday who is the owner of the resort Kim stated that it is the process of being purchased by a party through the bank of Belieze (or something like that, don't have the exact quote in front of me), you can listen to the conference call yourself and hear what he has to say.

Maybe Kim has sold the resort to someone else recently, I don't know.

Someone here sent a note to Fred Good (previous owner) to find out who is the current owner. Mr. Good stated it had been sold and he didn't wish to divulge who the new owner was.

Theres a surprise! I would hope he wouldn't tell just anyone private information.

Some time last year Kim stated that YMMSS had purchased the resort in Belieze (Surfer or someone can you remember when that was?). Earlier this spring during a Monday or Tuesday conference call Jim or Berry stated that Kim had purchased the resort in Belieze, and that profits from the resort were going into the CPA. Kim has made a similar statement numerous times on Thursday call.

AND?...

Someone is lying. Either Kim is lying about having purchased the resort earlier, or he is lying about it being in the process of being purchased. Mr. Good has no reason to lie about having sold it. Jim and Berry are just stating what they are told by Kim or Mark.

Isn't it possible that Kim did purchase to resort and now it is in the process of being purchased by someone else??? I don't care who owns the resort nor do I care, why do you?

This is just one thing Happy. Do your research, you will find numerous items where Kim has said one thing, only to later find out what he said and what actually happened are different.

Happy :)

[happy]

I like your excuses. Since you never heard those specific comments, he still didn't lie. Good logic.

I can't make that judgement just on what I read here. Why would I take the comments made here as fact when I haven't heard them for myself. Many things have been said here in MW that aren't entirely based on fact.
Happy :)

[swishnev]

happy, give us this fact? how many members of ymmss have not cycled even once?

[Arzel]

Happy :)

I don't have the time to find the specific comments here, but it is a fact that for months Kim stated that profits from the resort were going into the CPA. Recently, when pressed about the amount from the resort, he stated that there have been no profits and wouldn't be for at least the rest of this year. If you have listened to the conference calls you would know this to be true.

Arzel, This is not what I said I hadn't heard before. I do listen to the conference calls. I know this is true. I'm the one who said there were no profits in the post you are replying to.

My point exactly. Why don't you view the previous claims of profits going into the CPA not being true as a lie? What does it take to prove a lie to you, actually witnessing it?

When asked last Thursday who is the owner of the resort Kim stated that it is the process of being purchased by a party through the bank of Belieze (or something like that, don't have the exact quote in front of me), you can listen to the conference call yourself and hear what he has to say.

Maybe Kim has sold the resort to someone else recently, I don't know.

Like that would make any sense at all, and if he did why not just say it was sold to a new party?

Someone here sent a note to Fred Good (previous owner) to find out who is the current owner. Mr. Good stated it had been sold and he didn't wish to divulge who the new owner was.

Theres a surprise! I would hope he wouldn't tell just anyone private information.

Not the point...I was merely stating that there is proof the resort was sold, not that it is in the process of being sold

Some time last year Kim stated that YMMSS had purchased the resort in Belieze (Surfer or someone can you remember when that was?). Earlier this spring during a Monday or Tuesday conference call Jim or Berry stated that Kim had purchased the resort in Belieze, and that profits from the resort were going into the CPA. Kim has made a similar statement numerous times on Thursday call.

AND?...

And...Kim has said many times that the resort was pumping profits into the CPA, which was a BLATENT LIE!

Someone is lying. Either Kim is lying about having purchased the resort earlier, or he is lying about it being in the process of being purchased. Mr. Good has no reason to lie about having sold it. Jim and Berry are just stating what they are told by Kim or Mark.

Isn't it possible that Kim did purchase to resort and now it is in the process of being purchased by someone else???

Yes, but why lie about it?

This is just one thing Happy. Do your research, you will find numerous items where Kim has said one thing, only to later find out what he said and what actually happened are different.

Please provide some evidence that Kim did not lie about the resort, I have already provided ample evidence that he did.

[happy]

happy, give us this fact? how many members of ymmss have not cycled even once?

I wouldn't even know how to find that out nor would I take the time to.

[swishnev]

happy, that doesn't surprise me one bit.

[happy]

Please provide some evidence that Kim did not lie about the resort, I have already provided ample evidence that he did.

I can't and won't attempt to provide you with evidence of anything because I don't know whats going on in Belize. That would be stupid. I really don't see how that would be any of your business anyway.
Happy :)

[happy]

happy, that doesn't surprise me one bit.

Do you know how to find out and if you do why are you asking me?
I'm not gonna do your dirty work for you.

[Arzel]

I can't and won't attempt to provide you with evidence of anything because I don't know whats going on in Belize. That would be stupid. I really don't see how that would be any of your business anyway.
Happy :)


Well it is obvious tha you don't care if Kim is lying. Based on your responses though I suspect you knew he could not guarentee 90 day cycles intially, yet joined anyway. So Kim's ability to tell the truth is irrelevant to you, so long as you make money.

[swishnev]

happy, you are very much like a lot of the other pro-ymmss'ers. you lack substance behind your words and actions.

[happy]

Well it is obvious tha you don't care if Kim is lying. Based on your responses though I suspect you knew he could not guarentee 90 day cycles intially, yet joined anyway. So Kim's ability to tell the truth is irrelevant to you, so long as you make money.

If I suspected that Kim couldn't hold the 90 day cycle time and I joined anyway then that just means that perhaps I see longevity in this company and its not just about making fast money. Otherwise it wouldn't have made sense to join if I thought it wouldn't work.
Happy :)

[happy]

happy, you are very much like a lot of the other pro-ymmss'ers. you lack substance behind your words and actions.

Yes and you're very much full of substance and you didn't answer my question.
Do you know how to get the info that you wanted and if you do why are you asking me?
Happy :)

[swishnev]

happy, yes i know how to figure out the answer if i was a ymmss member.

[Arzel]

If I suspected that Kim couldn't hold the 90 day cycle time and I joined anyway then that just means that perhaps I see longevity in this company and its not just about making fast money. Otherwise it wouldn't have made sense to join if I thought it wouldn't work.
Happy :)

I take that as a "Yes" you don't care if Kim lied about cycle times.

I am curious though, YMMSS is not working right now, doesn't that worry you?

[Salsa]

happy, give us this fact? how many members of ymmss have not cycled even once?I wouldn't even know how to find that out nor would I take the time to.happy, that doesn't surprise me one bit.Do you know how to find out and if you do why are you asking me?
I'm not gonna do your dirty work for you.Nearly anyone who knows anything about YMMSS knows how to find out this information. And finding it is hardly dirty work. It is good and honorable work on behalf of the more than 15,000 members who have not yet cycled once but who bought into YMMSS because of lies and false promises that they would have cycled long before now. At least another 5,000 have cycled only once but remain in the red.

The filthy dirty work is being done by people like you, happy, when you defend a system of thievery even while you admit that you have no clue how it works. That is nothing but irresponsible by any standard. I think that you may want to be a good person, happy, but to create that facade for yourself you must currently keep yourself in complete denial of what kind of racket you are involved in. Simply calling yourself "happy" will not make you less miserable. You'll have to do something good with your life.

If you want to live with yourself for the rest of your life, you had better wake up to the facts and start making things right.

Salsa
_______

[swishnev]

thanks salsa, i knew the answer, just wondered if happy did :)

[Dreamer]

A couple things:

1. The amount of people who havent cycled might be more like 12,000. It was said only about 15,000 members turned in their survey. So, the original estimate of 22,000-25,000 members was probably just another lie to keep people believing in the system.
2. The resort in Belize is pretty useless for ymmss. Who cares if it was bought or not? If it was purchased, Kim is breaking the law. If it wasnt purchased, kim is lying to people. If its in the process of being purchased, than kim is in the process of breaking a law and has lied about the resort.

Does that show integrity regarding the person running this system? Somebody who is lying, and breaking laws, and has these rinky dink lawyers who hasnt advised him of potential laws he might be breaking?

And what about who he is running his system? Ok, the $3.09 seems like a good figure regarding weekly income based on $500,000, though i doubt they will even be getting a third of that once the new system kicks in. Listen to the conference calls and listen how they say...what if you are making $5/32? or $10/32? Thats as misleading as the "We've been at or under 90 days for 97% of the time, that should say something", or whatever the catch sentence of the week was when it was going above 90 days.

By saying a possible $10/32, people will get excited over that, but once they start making $.80 the first week without much of a change the following weelk. That will drop morale and faith in the system right there because they are receiving less than 10% of what they thought. I know my old boss wouldnt like me if I tried those tactics.

I personally think the only reason why kim has pushed for this new system so much because he knows that my January 15th prediction of making the Nov 19 payouts was probably too optomistic.

[concerned]

Theres a surprise! I would hope he wouldn't tell just anyone private information.


Since when is the name of a new owner private information? Every time I go into a business I think is very interesting, I ask who the owner is, and usually they tell me. Why is it private?

[Salsa]

The amount of people who havent cycled might be more like 12,000. It was said only about 15,000 members turned in their survey. So, the original estimate of 22,000-25,000 members was probably just another lie to keep people believing in the system.The member count at the end of October was 9,928. Extrapolating the membership for October 27 (the date that should probably get around to processing today), the number of members who have cycled one or more times is 9,750. The last accurate membership report was at the end of March: 23,564. Given the cash flow of YMMSS for April-June, statements that there were 25,000+ members by the end of June were, I think, credible. My extrapolations suggest that membership reached a little over 25,500 before the survey requirement. Surely 25,500 current members does not reflect the many months and years of attrition, and so many members have never been active in YMMSS at the same time, but I believe it is the most reasonable number of members who have bought into YMMSS that can currently be deduced. That leaves us with 25,500-9,750 = 15,750 members who have not cycled once.

Also, the number of members who have completed the survey is currently reported at 15,500, but apparently the policy of deactivating members who have not completed the survey has been at least temporarily lifted.

At least another 5,000 have cycled only once but remain in the red....should have read, "At least another 5,000 have cycled only once or remain in the red."

That 20,750 (15,750 + 5,000) is the bare minimum who are still in the red. There are almost certainly many more; e.g., DrZod who cycled four times and AvidA who cycled as many as six times and never received a penny in commissions.

Also, Dreamer, would you mind answering my question to you in post #4 of this thread?

Salsa
_________

[happy]

Nearly anyone who knows anything about YMMSS knows how to find out this information. And finding it is hardly dirty work.

It is dirty work if someone who has been kicked out of YM is trying to get information, that by the way is no concern of theirs anymore, from someone still in YM because they can't get it themselves and they want to use it to add to their little facts and figures.


The filthy dirty work is being done by people like you, happy, when you defend a system of thievery even while you admit that you have no clue how it works. That is nothing but irresponsible by any standard. I think that you may want to be a good person, happy, but to create that facade for yourself you must currently keep yourself in complete denial of what kind of racket you are involved in. Simply calling yourself "happy" will not make you less miserable. You'll have to do something good with your life.


If you want to live with yourself for the rest of your life, you had better wake up to the facts and start making things right.

Gee Salsa, such harsh words from someone who has berated other people in this forum for calling people names.
You've called me a doer of filthy dirty work, a defender of thievery, clueless, irresponsible, someone who wants to be a good person but apparently isn't, involved in a "racket", miserable, someone who has done no good in their life and possibly unable to live with myself for the rest of my life if I don't make amends.
Just where do you get off saying I'm not a good person and I'm miserable and I have to do something good in my life. How can you say those things? Just who do you think you are? That is a personal attack and its totally uncalled for.
The people in the forum always complain about the YMers coming in here and throwing around insults...well what do you think just happened here? :nono:
_______

[happy]

Since when is the name of a new owner private information? Every time I go into a business I think is very interesting, I ask who the owner is, and usually they tell me. Why is it private?

I don't believe real estate deals in the works would be public information especially to someone inquiring by mail until after settlement on the property is complete. And I'm sure that every time you waltz into a business you feel the need to ask who the owner is. Give me a break. I can see you now. You walk into a local "interesting" restaurant and before you sit down to eat you find it necessary to ask who the owner is. Get real. You guys here have some real egos.
Happy :) and laughing at you.

[swishnev]

"It is dirty work if someone who has been kicked out of YM is trying to get information, that by the way is no concern of theirs anymore, from someone still in YM because they can't get it themselves and they want to use it to add to their little facts and figures."

It is a concern of mine since I still have friends in YMMSS

[Dreamer]

I think it was this thread, but I'm not sure, so i'll post my worthless opinion anyways.

It was asked, what does $93million in commissions paid mean?

Well, if I go to a local used car dealership for an interview, and they inform me that their salesmen made $3million in commissions last year alone, i assume because of the service they are providing the car dealership (selling cars) they were able to earn that amount of money from the sales.

So, if I'm told $93million was paid in commissions, I would assume that the service they are rendering their employeer (reading ads) they were able to garnish the $93million in commissions. However, who paid for these commissions?

People who bought cars paid for the commissions of the used car lot. I guess the people who bought advertising paid for the $93million? Perhaps. However, with the used car salesmen, the money is being injected into the business by outside individuals who are purchasing the cars making the business a profit. There are no outside advertisers and the only advertising revenues currently obtained is thru inside advertising.

So, who is paying these commissions? Well, its the newer advertisers. Who will be expected to pay the new commissions? The retail advertisers. Will they be told that that in essence they are not really participating in an advertising venture, but they are in al reality becoming part business owners of this business, and their job it to continue the payouts at their own expense? That they are in fact taking over the liability of the company under guise that its an advertsing business.

Typically, when somebody assumes the liability of a business, there is present or future considerations, perhaps outright ownership of the business, or something similiar.

That said, there is nothing we should worry about STA lying to potential advertisers, because people who do advertising are not as stupid as kim hopes they are. Frankly, the memberbase of ymmss provides nothing of any value to any potential advertiser, whether it is 16,000 members, 100/100, or 1million/1million. Because the point of advertising is to make money, not to help other people make money.

But you got to admire kim. In quickly switching over to Plan B, he has successfully rid himself of all liabilities and is able to take ymmss to the graveyard and not worry about people complaining now that people are paid weekly.

[Arzel]

Not only that Dreamer, but you have people like Happy backing Kim's worthless Plan B to the hilt.

Happy,

What is your purpose here? You obivously choose not to see anything wrong with YMMSS. Even when presented overwhelming evidence you continue to disagree, or attempt to change the topic. You accuse us of attack, when similar commentary on the YM forums would be deleted within an hour, and I believe Salsa made a very good point.

You are just as responsible as Kim for the losses that thousands of YM members will endure. There is no way you can truthfully state that you don't believe Kim lied to you, yet you continue to say this. It is obvious you only protecting your own best interest, which seems to be a common theme among many high level YMMSSer's....kind of goes against the "people helping people" theme, don't you think?

[happy]

It is a concern of mine since I still have friends in YMMSS

Then let your friends get the info for you.

[concerned]

I don't believe real estate deals in the works would be public information especially to someone inquiring by mail until after settlement on the property is complete.

The previous owner said he had ALREADY SOLD IT. IT ISN'T IN THE WORKS FOR THE PREVIOUS OWNER. DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND???????????

And I'm sure that every time you waltz into a business you feel the need to ask who the owner is. Give me a break. I can see you now. You walk into a local "interesting" restaurant and before you sit down to eat you find it necessary to ask who the owner is.

I said every time I see an interesting business. I never said it was all the time. I has happened several times though. What difference does it make how many times. The point is that I have never been told it was private.

[swishnev]

happy, obviously that information is not available to members for some reason. they have tried through the help desk, conference calls and emails. i'm sorry you find it to be wrong that i'm trying to help out people i care about.

[happy]

Not only that Dreamer, but you have people like Happy backing Kim's worthless Plan B to the hilt.

Happy,

What is your purpose here?


Well Arzel,
My purpose here (see my first post in this thread) was to encourage the people in this forum (at dreamers suggestion) to leave YM alone for a while and let the new system take effect and see what happens and voice my opinions. I was being very nice. I even wished AvidA my hope that he would get his money back. Then you, ARZEL, started jumping down my throat, as usual. See post #10.
You have the nerve to complain about what happens in the YM forums but all you want to do here is berate people and attack them for what they believe.Then SALSA starts attacking my personality and my life. And you want people to think the people in this forum are so kind and caring. HAH!!!
So what is my purpose here? It was to state an opinion but as usual if its not in agreement with the people here the mudslinging and name calling starts.
So I think for now I will wipe my hands of this bunch, its beginning to smell funny in here. TaTa.
Always,
Happy :)

[happy]

happy, obviously that information is not available to members for some reason. they have tried through the help desk, conference calls and emails. i'm sorry you find it to be wrong that i'm trying to help out people i care about.

Swishnev,
I don't understand, if your friends who are members can't get the info for you, why do I get jumped on for not getting it. I'm just a member too. They see what I see. And I don't think its wrong to try to help your friends. I think its great. But they need to help you help themselves by getting the info you need. If its not available what do you want from me?
Happy :)

[happy]

The previous owner said he had ALREADY SOLD IT. IT ISN'T IN THE WORKS FOR THE PREVIOUS OWNER. DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND???????????

And I'm sure that every time you waltz into a business you feel the need to ask who the owner is. Give me a break. I can see you now. You walk into a local "interesting" restaurant and before you sit down to eat you find it necessary to ask who the owner is.

I said every time I see an interesting business. I never said it was all the time. I has happened several times though. What difference does it make how many times. The point is that I have never been told it was private.






Chill, will ya? Theres no need to yell. :)

[Arzel]

Well Arzel,
My purpose here (see my first post in this thread) was to encourage the people in this forum (at dreamers suggestion) to leave YM alone for a while and let the new system take effect and see what happens and voice my opinions. I was being very nice. I even wished AvidA my hope that he would get his money back. Then you, ARZEL, started jumping down my throat, as usual. See post #10.
You have the nerve to complain about what happens in the YM forums but all you want to do here is berate people and attack them for what they believe.Then SALSA starts attacking my personality and my life. And you want people to think the people in this forum are so kind and caring. HAH!!!
So what is my purpose here? It was to state an opinion but as usual if its not in agreement with the people here the mudslinging and name calling starts.
So I think for now I will wipe my hands of this bunch, its beginning to smell funny in here. TaTa.
Always,
Happy :)

Sorry Happy,

I can't leave YMMSS alone. Now that the Ponzi has at least appeared to gain new steam it would be wrong to just sit ildly by and see thousands of people throw more money away when there is no evidence that anything will change.

I am upset with people like you, who are now praising a new system that hasn't even started yet, while at the same time poo-pooing the problems of the old as if they didn't even exist.

I am upset because people were starting to see YMMSS for what it was, and now thanks to the likes of the YMMSS promoters many of these people are now probably going to sit back and wait a few more months, wasting valuable time to actually do something about their situation.

When YMMSS finally bites the dust, I will hold people like you personally responsible because it is people like yourself that truely understand what YMMSS is all about, and yet choose to do nothing about it. I have very little pity or patience for people that put their own self-interest above everyone else. If you wish to view it as an attack that is your perojative, but to come here, provide no facts to back up your point of view, and disregard even the most basic evidence of Kim's lies shows me what kind of person you really are.

[swishnev]

very well said arzel

[Salsa]

Nearly anyone who knows anything about YMMSS knows how to find out this information. And finding it is hardly dirty work. It is good and honorable work on behalf of the more than 15,000 members who have not yet cycled once but who bought into YMMSS because of lies and false promises that they would have cycled long before now.It is dirty work if someone who has been kicked out of YM is trying to get information, that by the way is no concern of theirs anymore, from someone still in YM because they can't get it themselves and they want to use it to add to their little facts and figures.Swishnev knew the answer to this question before he even asked it of you, as he later pointed out and I already recognized. When he asked you, he was simply testing to see if you had any clue of the dire straits that YMMSS is in. You replied, "I wouldn't even know how to find that out," i.e., you were as clueless about the facts as you were about swishnev's motive for asking you.

The filthy dirty work is being done by people like you, happy, when you defend a system of thievery even while you admit that you have no clue how it works. That is nothing but irresponsible by any standard. I think that you may want to be a good person, happy, but to create that facade for yourself you must currently keep yourself in complete denial of what kind of racket you are involved in. Simply calling yourself "happy" will not make you less miserable. You'll have to do something good with your life.

If you want to live with yourself for the rest of your life, you had better wake up to the facts and start making things right.Gee Salsa, such harsh words from someone who has berated other people in this forum for calling people names.

You've called me a doer of filthy dirty work, a defender of thievery, clueless, irresponsible, someone who wants to be a good person but apparently isn't, involved in a "racket", miserable, someone who has done no good in their life and possibly unable to live with myself for the rest of my life if I don't make amends.
Just where do you get off saying I'm not a good person and I'm miserable and I have to do something good in my life. How can you say those things? Just who do you think you are? That is a personal attack and its totally uncalled for.
The people in the forum always complain about the YMers coming in here and throwing around insults...well what do you think just happened here?What just happened here, happy, was a little tough love. You've told me enough about yourself through your posts here that, giving you the benefit of the doubt, you are a good person at heart. I've also studied YMMSS enough to know, without reasonable doubt, that it is a scam designed to make a few people rich at the expense of others.

On the day when you discover this, too, as a good person at heart you are going to be miserable that you have supported and defended what you have. Deep in your heart you already suspect this. Acknowledging such doubts is very painful, and in such situations the first tendency for us all is to deny them rather than risk coming face to face with the terrible truth. We'll go to great lengths to keep our doubts suppressed in order to maintain some sense of well-being, and we'll avoid learning anything new that might support them and bring them closer to the surface.

The fact that you remain so unwilling to acknowledge, accept or assimilate any of the disturbing facts about YMMSS that are presented here, strongly suggests that this describes your predicament with YMMSS.

I don't expect you to accept my opinion of YMMSS at face value. I don't even want you to do that. It's important that you know the foundation of that opinion--all the elements that clearly reveal that YMMSS is a scam--first hand, for yourself. To reach that point, I only encourage you to become more knowledgeable about how YMMSS is structured and why the past and present promises of its administration were and are impossible to keep--and that the administration has known it all along.

I know that you don't want to do that because it will be very painful for you on the day when you realize that YMMSS's only purpose is to cheat you out of your money and that you have also been helping a cheater cheat others. Nevertheless, the sooner the better. The longer you take, the more painful that moment will be--especially in the face of your opportunity to glean some elements of the truth here at Matrix Watch.

And if you never do the necessary work to find and fully accept the truth and to acknowledge it, the reality will still exist and eat at your heart for the rest of your life. I don't want that for you. That's the tough love stuff.

I wish you well,
Salsa
________

[Trinket]

Happy, I'm with you ALL THE WAY!

Respectfully,
Trinket :applause:

[happy]

Thanks Trinket,
I see why other other YM members eventually quit posting here. It's really not worth the time, when these self proclaimed savers of the YM members can do nothing but throw insults around and tell me they're giving me "tough love" like I was their 17 year old drug addicted son and needed daddy to tell me right from wrong. Big egos in here.
Happy :)

[Salsa]

Happy: Act like a drug addicted 17 year old and get treated like a drug addicted 17 year old. If you really do know right from wrong, happy, then you are quickly erasing the benefit of any doubt I have about you.

Salsa
________

[AvidA]

Whew! I missed a lot of this thread so I will start by saying "thank you to Happy for wishing me well with YM" But I will tell you facts as to why I don't have faith and why you might want to at least take these guys up on what they say and "think about it". I noticed on page three that you indicated that you were inclined for facts. Here are some:

Fact: We were told countless lies about doubling, then about how cycle times would go down if more EPCs were purchased. Now we are told "our" system (business) is revamped, without prior knowlege to this. It keeps people like you and I hopeful because Kim is taking 22% with or without us and if we make money or not. We may fail, that has been stated in the forums (even though morale is good there for now). They still know we may fail. But Kim will not fail. He will get his and is getting his whether we do or not. That is a fact. And while I believe that Kim cares somewhat about people--as is true to the nature of man---he really cares for Kim. That is evident or he would take some of the millions he made and give it to those who have not cycled. At least, give them their investment (and that's what it is according to Webster) back. He is a man who wants money, money, money at all cost and clearly to make a name for himself. That is evident because he KNOWS how much he will still be getting but we're led to 'wait and see". Who do you think he is really caring for? He is not a saint. That is also a fact.

Fact: you and I have to "wait and see" about what is being called "our" business. It is a fact that that in and of itself is odd even to the dullest of business people. Even Esto gets his butt kicked in this forum. And the reason being is because, like you and I, he doesn't know either. He knows that he's made money because he had more to put in. I know because I joined before him and have never been paid. So, he is optimistic and understandably so. But his answers are always, "I assume" or "it has been suggested" or just plain "I don't know". Sounds a bit like he is guessing...just like the rest of us suckers.

Fact: Mike Hamilton is bound by contract by Kim (or so he says) not to say which Fortune 20 company he came from. In this United States there is no reason for such secrecy. None. I have mulled that one over a thousand ways and the only conclusion would be that it's because he was never in a Fortune 20 company which would explain why he is always saying "I don't know", and "that would be up to Kim", etc.

The worst fact: No one can tell us how much we will make or even pinpoint when we will make it. And if you do the math, there is no way--even with the supposed 19 million dollar investment that you can keep paying people a lot of money as the more people who join the less the value of the dollar will be. Yet in knowing this, Kim will still not cap anything and he still will not look out for us even though in the forums they would have you believing he does. He does not! He is looking to the future for his being a mult-millionaire and having a name for himself in advertising. We are just blinded employees and NOT business owners. Because here's another fact. If I was a business owner, I would take my initial investment back from this YM and run for the hills.

You are caught where I was--in a web of lies and what's worse a hope for a better tomorrow with YM. Well, another fact: YM just keeps on getting more daunting and confusion belongs to the devil and does not bring me any happines whatsoever. Kim has stolen my money based on those lies in the original (no longer available) contract that stated all I had to do was read ads for a half an hour per week and my money would double. No evolution was mentioned just a dream that he had one night. Our hands are tied. You cannot get your money back and most likely never will. Try to listen to the voices of reason here. At least they let you post your feelings without the commie pinko deletion that goes on in the YMForums.

While I admire your spunk and optimism it is time to face those afore-mentioned facts and then some. I wish you well, I really do.

[AvidA]

Kim has stolen my money but not my hope...just my hope in YM.

[bigdaddy]

With you as well Happy.

Misery here loves its company.

From what I have read so far, the forum rotwielers seem to be salivating, snarling and savaging you.

Give the new system a chance before you write the epitaph.

Anything else is blind ignorance.

Admin says they speak on behalf of 15K unpaid; let me see their credentials on this.

15K names with permission to bleat on their behalf , thanks.

Bigdaddy :nono: :shake:


Thanks Trinket,
I see why other other YM members eventually quit posting here. It's really not worth the time, when these self proclaimed savers of the YM members can do nothing but throw insults around and tell me they're giving me "tough love" like I was their 17 year old drug addicted son and needed daddy to tell me right from wrong. Big egos in here.
Happy :)

[happy]

Thank you Big Daddy!! :)

Happy :)

[gmsource]

I have to agree with Avida. YMMSS is all a bunch of lies and is a ponzi built upon that. I'm sorry you "happy" guys can't see that but it doesn't change the fact that we will never get our money back but Kim has gotten millions. I also find it interesting that today in the general forum of ads under the announcements section there is a note that says any blatant negative advertisement will be removed. So much for free speech

[Leonidas]

With you as well Happy.



Admin says they speak on behalf of 15K unpaid; let me see their credentials on this.

15K names with permission to bleat on their behalf , thanks.



15 K is an easy number to come up with.....it is pretty obvious that no one joining after Nov. 19th has been paid.....or whatever the magic date is :shake:

[AvidA]

With their permission: R Graham, M Birke, J Davis, And C Riordan. There's four people who put in a LOT of money and never got paid. Now it's blind ignorance and just plain evil to say that these four people don't count. I don't know the names of the other 14,996 and I don't need to. I know that if even ONE PERSON loses because of false statements and "mismanaged money"; yet Kim is still getting richer...then there is a problem. Not even one person should be a casualty of one man's war to get richer. These are just people I know personally who are freaked out! Totally lost and do NOT trust Kim Inman at all as he has changed his story too many times. Shame on you.. Shame!

[concerned]

Give the new system a chance before you write the epitaph.

Anything else is blind ignorance.


Well, this is funny. Let me explain something to you. Blind ignorance is not about not giving this site another chance. It is blind ignorance to watch a site fail, then stay with them and not complain while they try again. If they failed once, chances are they will fail again. Now, you know that are not good at success, so why stay with them? STAYING WITH THEM IS BLIND IGNORANCE!!!

[spdrvii]

Hi :applause:

[Jim_Inkimscolon]

I'd have to agree with both AvidA and spdrvii. They make a lot of sense.

[lionking]

Jim,

I like your username!!!

lol lol lol

[AvidA]

Let me guess, Jim. You're saying a certain "jim" is a brown noser? What a hilarious post! hahahahaha

[Jim_Inkimscolon]

Thank you, lionking. "Seeing IS believing" and even I, Jim_Inkimscolon, cannot believe what I'm seeing. From partially digested cashews to the bits and pieces of people who have bought $10 EPCs!!!

[AvidA]

I guess I should be ecstatic. I am the half with all the 320's that are now so in demand. I'll sell some to you real cheap...lol As I don't think either of us will get a dime.

You're too funny!!

[lionking]

AvidA wrote:

I don't think either of us will get a dime.


Totally disagree!!!

:D :D :D

IMHO, we gonna get a dime!!!

lol lol lol

[brenda]

LionKing Lets hope you at least get 8 dimes so you can get that pair of sox you have been needing for 6 months now.






AvidA wrote:




Totally disagree!!!

:D :D :D

IMHO, we gonna get a dime!!!

lol lol lol

[AvidA]

Lionking, you'd better ask family for those socks for Christmas lol 'Cause I don't think anyone's getting a DIME. I think this is a big set up to get people to pour more in and then they are gonna take it all and run with it. They've got something evil cooked up. :evil:

I was supposed to cycle and get paid today for the first time. I have been in the system for two years and have never been paid. I watched....and what do ya know? My estimated date of the 18th jumped all the way to the 27th! Leaving me without getting paid again! :head:

There you have it. We ain't never gettin that dime! :shake:

[brenda]

LionKing, if you haven't got your sox by xmas, I will buy you a pair..maybe each of us could buy you a pair and then you can get through the winter.

My question is, when the new payment system comes up over at YM. WHERE are they going to get the money from to pay everybody?

P.S. Avida, I am sorry for you. That is horrible to have your payment date pushed so far.

P.S. Everybody, I didn't know YM was a Ponzi until I started reading these messages at MW. I always suspected it was, but I guess we learn something every day!!

[AvidA]

Maybe we could all rub our only two nickels we have left together and make a pair of socks for LionKing. lol

Don't be sorry for me Brenda. I take full responsibity for my own folly. I trusted before doing the math for myself. Two years ago people were getting paid left and right and I went with that instead of my own understanding or DD. *sigh*

[brenda]

how cheap will you sell them for :confused:





I guess I should be ecstatic. I am the half with all the 320's that are now so in demand. I'll sell some to you real cheap...lol As I don't think either of us will get a dime.

You're too funny!!

[AvidA]

[QUOTE=brenda]
My question is, when the new payment system comes up over at YM. WHERE are they going to get the money from to pay everybody? QUOTE]

Sorry, Brenda. To answer that question; I believe the money will be coming from the thin air like it always has. Maybe that's why it feels so light slipping through my fingers. lol lol lol Seriously, there is no money. If there were cycle times would have never slowed and people such as myself would still be getting paid instead of shoved onto the back burner. :shake:

[brenda]

Of course it's a set-up. It's like walking into a casino over there. Everybody is blinded and deafened by all the blinking lights and kerching of the slots. You give them a bucket full of quarters and they all rush out and buy another bucket full of $10s or $320s, all depending on what the slot machine of the day is being advertised as the best one. Right now everybody is rushing out to buy more $320s. Two weeks ago everybody was rushing out tobuy $10s.


I think this is a big set up to get people to pour more in and then they are gonna take it all and run with it. They've got something evil cooked up. :evil:

[AvidA]

how cheap will you sell them for :confused:

Well, let's see...to get the total amount of 13,000 plus change back that I have put in total..... lol lol lol lol

Save your money for gold exchanges.

[brenda]

Would you sell them to me on credit? I can pay you as soon as I get paid from YM. Of course, first I have to file bankruptcy, but after I pay my lawyer, then I can start paying you for the 320s, as soon as I get paid from YM.




Well, let's see...to get the total amount of 13,000 plus change back that I have put in total..... lol lol lol lol

Save your money for gold exchanges.

[mechanic]

It is simply amazing to see people coming in here to say how great and amazing YM is when even if they dont want to admit it,YM is going down the tubes of history. I was one of the extremely lucky ones that was the first one to recieve a full refund of my initial. I also was sold on the premise of the advertising scheme,and that is what it really was,a pipedream.
I did not really realize what it was until I joined and then I started to see that there was no value at all to the advertising portion. I thought that there would be meaningful and legit companies advertising,instead,they wanted me to read bizz-opps,happy birthday and congrat ads. Now who in their right mind wants to read that?

It is also amusing and ironic to see YM members being so happy about the sad state of afairs of YM,I wonder how many of them are just hoping to get other un-suspecting individuals to join in the hope that they might cycle and got out of dodge?
I also wonder if the ones that cycled and had thousands paid actually did the stupid thing and actually let it ride,when they had to know that they would not see their money again.

Dont you think that they would be smart and take the money and just maybe say that they let it ride,what do you think? Would they do the smart thing or the dumb thing? Under the new system,it is a no-brainer money loser,but since they are stuck with it,they really have no option,but to go along with it. They have to know that there is no way that they will ever get even in their lifetime even if YM lasts 20 yrs. We all know that there is not any chance of YM surviving,the hand writing has been on the wall for months,but everyone is hoping against un-surmountable odds that YM will survive,and there is no way that it can.

I have read this whole amusing thread and smiled at the ones that are hoping that they can get someone to join,so that maybe they can cycle and get out.I know that the members that are in YM now are just hoping that they can get out with the money,although they claim to be sold on it 100%,I do not believe anyone can be that nieve at this late date.

Layton

[AvidA]

Dont you think that they would be smart and take the money and just maybe say that they let it ride,what do you think? Would they do the smart thing or the dumb thing? Under the new system,it is a no-brainer money loser,but since they are stuck with it,they really have no option,but to go along with it. They have to know that there is no way that they will ever get even in their lifetime even if YM lasts 20 yrs. We all know that there is not any chance of YM surviving,the hand writing has been on the wall for months,but everyone is hoping against un-surmountable odds that YM will survive,and there is no way that it can.

Layton

Actually, Layton, I don't think that some of these die-hards are smart at all about this whole thing. I think greed is clouding the senses. That is what I see in the YM forums. I also see that "hope" is a big thing that Kim is toying with there. To take someone's money..like mine..well it's shame on me. But he's stealing so many people's hope that many won't recover for a very long time, if at all. If there were suicides I would not be surprised. However, if there were no law suits file I would be extremely surprised.

As far as the new version of the YM mystery, it's just another dangling carrot that keeps the masses bringing in more. No one ever really knows anything unless they're paid to know and shut up about it. The rest are relying on hope. I really believe that. I hear greed when I open the doors of YM forums...greed and censorship like I've never seen in my life. :shake:

[brenda]

Now that they know we are on to their censorship tactics, they will try something else. Yes, suicides are a very good possibility. The seriously depressed people do not post any more. I have seen those posts, but they have all been swept under the rug.







Actually, Layton, I don't think that some of these die-hards are smart at all about this whole thing. I think greed is clouding the senses. That is what I see in the YM forums. I also see that "hope" is a big thing that Kim is toying with there. To take someone's money..like mine..well it's shame on me. But he's stealing so many people's hope that many won't recover for a very long time, if at all. If there were suicides I would not be surprised. However, if there were no law suits file I would be extremely surprised.

As far as the new version of the YM mystery, it's just another dangling carrot that keeps the masses bringing in more. No one ever really knows anything unless they're paid to know and shut up about it. The rest are relying on hope. I really believe that. I hear greed when I open the doors of YM forums...greed and censorship like I've never seen in my life. :shake:

[bowmaker]

WOW !!
i posted 3 or 4 times today on ymmss and they all got through without deletion in the first 5 minutes . havent been able to do get a post last longer than 5 minutes for about a week now . moderator alan even responded to one . told me to read the tou . i'll bet ive read the tou more times than he has.

[brenda]

bowmaker, is that "all" alan told you :D

[lionking]

ohh, this Sheep from Highlands...

:D :D :D

I would LOVE to squeeze my teeth around his neck!!!

lol lol lol

[AvidA]

You should have heard alan last night to dagwood. He was so unbelievably rude. But the dirty lowlander gets away with it. :shake:

[Deso]

An embarrasment to the scots. :shake:

[brenda]

(and the Christians)


An embarrasment to the scots. :shake:

[AvidA]

Is Alan a proclaiming Christian? Wow, maybe that's where he gets this "God is good" thing. God has to be GREAT cause Alan would drain Him of His grace. lol lol lol lol

[BTCohen]

You should have heard alan last night to dagwood. He was so unbelievably rude. But the dirty lowlander gets away with it. :shake:

Did this happen in their forum or on the live chat thing they have? Could you show it here? Is it allowed?

[AvidA]

Yes, it happened in the forum. And yes I can post it here. Another post was placed here yesterday where Esto had threatened a woman. He asked her if she "wanted to make something of it?" BUllies! The lot of them!

[BTCohen]

Makes you wonder doesn't it? I have been on lot's of forums but rarely see moderators being aggresive. Can't imagine Esto being aggresive as he is quite old and is very tolerant in my experience. Is it possible his words are being misinterpreted? Hmm! :rolleyes:

Where can I see these things?

[AvidA]

So, you don't believe it BT? You wanna make something of it?

[BTCohen]

So, you don't believe it BT? You wanna make something of it?

:) Not me, I'm a nice person. (most of the time) Yes I believe it, I just wanted to have a look. Oh well.

[AvidA]

My point, BT was in that statement: "wanna make something of it?" Because that is exactly what esto said to that lady right in plain view of everyone. It's hard to misinterpret that statement, isn't it? He was a big bullying coward to say a thing like that.

I guess she was in violation of TOU because of repetition or something...but still...when is it ok to threaten a person?? He's a joke!

[AvidA]

Oops, sorry. You can see these things in the thread called "wanna make something of it" right here at matrix watch. It's long but it's all there. :)

[BTCohen]

I just wanted to look at the original posts of Esto and Alan. Morbid curiosity let's say. :evil:

[AvidA]

If you're a YM member you can go have a look in the archives. They're there...the ones with Alan anyway. The one with Esto finally had to be edited because too many people were jumping down the mods throat about why she hadn't deleted it but deleted everyone elses. I don't know what to tell you. If you're a member of YM you could have seen and heard it., It was all a buzz here yesterday.

[BTCohen]

I dont go there every day and I just registered here so I wasn't aware. A couple of days away from a forum and it seems that it goes crazy. Thanks for the info all the same.

[BTCohen]

I give in, cant find it. I read Esto's but cant find the other one.

[surfer]

The two "want to make something of it" threads
here should show enough.

As for Esto's comment, the written word is usually
open to interpretation. I read it as a statement from
a man who is agitated by the need to constantly
defend his scam. I viewed the comment as being
made in jest, but you could sense his very real agitation.

Perhaps we could lighten up a little on the personal
comments and insults about certain YMMSS members.
Describing specific actions and misdeeds will usually get
your point across about what you think of their character.

[Somebody]

The original posts were sent to Archives yesterday at YM. The threads were started by dagwood. They are entitled "How to have a a debate in YMMSS" and "Elaborating Dissent". THey have been edited by Esto and other moderators., especially one comment where one member likened the YM forums to living in Cambodia or Nazi Germany. The complete unedited unvarnished truth can be found here under the two threads "Wanna Make Something Of It".




I just wanted to look at the original posts of Esto and Alan. Morbid curiosity let's say. :evil: