PayPal

[MatrixWatch]

Why was PayPal freezing matrix sites left and right? Why do they still do it? Why did it appear that smaller sites were untouched, but larger matrix sites were quickly acted upon. I found this quote reported at PayPalSucks.com. PayPalSucks is a great watchdog site, and I admire all that they do there. I would greatly like to have further dialogue with the owner, since our causes are very closely related at this time. Here at Matrix Watch we often get info on the pay companies before they do there, so it would be great if we could exchange information.

Here is a quote from a recent quarterly report:

From: http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1065088/000089161803004232/f92035e10vq.htm

As part of PayPal’s program to reduce fraud losses, it may temporarily restrict the ability of customers to withdraw their funds if those funds or their account activity are identified by PayPal’s anti-fraud models as suspicious. PayPal is subject to several purported class action lawsuits challenging its procedures and disclosures with respect to suspicious accounts, and alleging that those procedures and disclosures violate federal and state law on consumer protection and unfair business practice and are inconsistent with PayPal’s user agreement. In addition, many customers who are subject to such restrictions complain to regulatory agencies. As a result of customer complaints, PayPal has also received inquiries regarding its restriction practices from the Federal Trade Commission and the attorneys general of a number of states. If PayPal’s processes are found to violate federal or state law on consumer protection and unfair business practices, it could be subject to an enforcement action or fines. If PayPal loses the litigation described above or becomes subject to an enforcement action, it could be required to restructure its anti-fraud processes in ways that would harm its business, and to pay substantial damages or fines. Even if PayPal is able to defend itself successfully, the litigation or enforcement action could cause damage to its reputation, could consume substantial amounts of its management’s time and attention, and could require PayPal to change its customer service and operations in ways that could increase its costs and decrease the effectiveness of its anti-fraud program.


Remember that we are suing PayPal for their support of the matrix sites which allegedly violate unfair business practice laws.

Feel free to detour this thread to discuss whatever you would like to about PayPal.com.

[FightingBack]

Well, I have tried reporting little sites such as www.SuperMatrixBlitz.Com that use PayPal still, but PayPal just wont seem to close their account.

Now I am a suporter for the matrix sites, so don't get me wrong about turning in this site to PayPal. But I have heard so many bad stories about these people, along with their two other sites they owned that shut down.

I really feel PayPal should terminate their account with them, but look at their PayPal account they have over 900 verified buyers!

How do you go about reporting sites like these to PayPal when PayPal wont even listen to me?

[MatrixWatch]

Those who report sites have contacted me with this contact:

ofacappeal@paypal

Perhaps they could help. Let us know. From what I know, PayPal has policies against these matrix sites, but, as the top post reveals, they may be selective as to which ones they freeze.

[Bulldog]

Watchdog,
We are supposed to let YOU know when we report a site using paypal? If so, the applematrix one was my doing.

[MatrixWatch]

Someone just gave me this email address instead for reporting violators to PayPal:

paypal-compliance@paypal.com

Thanks you "anonymous member"

[MatrixWatch]

Originally posted by Bulldog
Watchdog,
We are supposed to let YOU know when we report a site using paypal? If so, the applematrix one was my doing.

That is interesting, because Apple Matrix has been going around telling their customers that it was me who shut down their account.

[ycchen]

Unfortunately, most of the matrices that I dig up using paypal are still operating...:(( May be we need more people to file complaints to paypal, so that paypal will take it seriously.

[damion]

It has been my experience that PayPal will not shut you down until you have a substantial amount of money in your account. They will wait until you are withdrawing a large sum and since it takes 4 days in some cases to download your money they will sit on it and reverse the download at the last minute - then shut you down. This way, they can collect interest off much more money for 180 days while you can do nothing about getting your money freed up.

Did you want some customer service with that? PayPal has none.

Damion

[ycchen]

Originally posted by damion This way, they can collect interest off much more money for 180 days while you can do nothing about getting your money freed up.

Did you want some customer service with that? PayPal has none.


If I understand correctly, the primarily purpose of freezing matrix's account so that paypal (1) can refund the customers who ask for a refund within 60 days of their purchase, or (2) provide some sort of compensation after the lawsuit.

Are you suggesting that we can get customer service from matrix's owner instead of paypal? You must be joking, right? When matrix owner grab your money, they will never refund you. So, what kind of service are you talking about?

If paypal freeze the matrix's account, victims MIGHT have a chance to get refund at the end of the day, even if it might take a while. However, if paypal allow the owners to withdraw all the money, then I garantee that the victims will NEVER RECEIVE ANY REFUND. Unless, they file class lawsuit against the matrices. Even with the lawsuit, they might still get nothing as matrix's owners might simply declare bankcrupsy.

You can disagree with me, but I trust paypal more than the owner becuase paypal has help me reverse charges on quite a few scammers on ebay auctions.

Therefore, I believe that victims will have a better chance to get some compensation from paypal than from any matrix owners.

[damion]

I believe you misconstrued the point I was trying to make. I was not stating that you could get your money from a matrix owner any quicker than PayPal.

My point was that PayPal does this to a lot of people - and most are legitimate retail operations. I have seen PayPal freeze a supplier of Plasma TV's (where the purchase price is in the $5,000+ range) when they had over $50,000 in their account and then told them that no one was getting the money until after 180 days were up and then (once that period was up) the owner would receive a check for the amount. Luckily, this particular supplier was a high volume dealer and was able to ship out product and sit back and wait for his money. If this would have been your average small dealer it would have easily put them out of business.

I have seen PayPal single-handedly put numerous legitimate businesses out of business by their "policies" as they state. This is why there are so many "PayPal Hate" sites out there. Two of the larger ones the last time I looked were:
www.paypalsucks.com
www.paypalwarning.com

I will never do business with PayPal again for one reason:
I was selling things on eBay (legit - nothing to do with matrix or information) and they froze my account. Lucky for me it was only $175 but PayPal does this to anyone at anytime just because they can get away with it and collect the interest off the money you have in your account at that time.

The viewpoints expressed herein about PayPal collecting interest was read off another website where a user had posted stating that he worked for PayPal. I do not know for a fact that this is why they hold your funds and should be taken as speculatory. (End Legal Disclaimer)

Damion

[Lancer]

Paypal was so much better when it wasnt owned by Ebay

[ycchen]

Damion

So, you are not making any comparison between paypal and matrix owner in regards to who will refund victims' money? If so, okay, I misunderstood you, sorry.

From the matrix's seller's standpoint, I understand why owners hate paypal for freezing their fund. However, from the buyers' standpoint, I believe that paypal does a good job by protecting the interest of buyers (and themselves, of course). Of course, we still need to urge paypal to refund money from the fund that they seized from owners.

Obviously, we do not share the same wavelength. I assume that since you are done with matrix, may be you will for once take the position of a buyers. It seems that my assumption is wrong. You still pretty much stand firmly on the interest and rights of matrix's owners. And you still comfortably endorsing so called 'honest' matrices. That's prefectly fine with me, I just want to clarify our differences so that we won't have misunderstanding in the future. ..:)

[concerned]

This thread was seriously getting off topic. I split this thread. Please don't allow this to happen again. Keep talking about PayPal here.