Ok....any Hard Evidence Yet?

[mitrod3]

As the discussion goes on:

Folks....is there any "real hard evidence" out there that Trevor was actually trying to rip anyone off (objective hard stuff here) as opposed to just goofing up in the paper work area and being a touch creative (very creative) in how he presented things to everyone and their aunt and uncle?

Hard solid stuff that speaks to hearts intent as opposed to "it looked like a nice overall idea that was just executed very poorly".

"REAL HARD EVIDENCE" here.....not just what we think, speculate or assume, one way or the other because it looks like this or looks like that, in relation to what might have been going on. Anything HARD that actually points to intent of heart and motive?

At this point in time it seems that his actions (as I keep hearing in various discussions with folks here) can be viewed from a number of directions from purposeful intent to deceive to just not having the business sense to properly put together all the aspects of something actually intended to help people.

Anything in his background or history that points to intent here?

I simply ask because folks are asking for more than just what it all looks like one way or the other. They are asking for Hard Evidence to be presented.......or it does stay in the realm of speculation, one way or the other, on people's parts.

Some are simply not buying the "it looks like a scam, so it must be a scam approach"....they want "intent" clarifed and verified. Even Trevors juggling of truth in being presented as just a mistake in judgement and action. The papers he signed are being explained as his way of saving money to keep it available to pay people back instead of going to lawyers and also a way to speed up the flow of the settlement and the pay back at this point, a nice thing to do on his part.

Any HARD EVIDENCE? Not just spin or speculation one way or the other.

Thanks

[HonestIncome]

Reed, Kimbrell and CEP acted with scienter, that is, with an intent to deceive, manipulate or defraud or with a severe reckless disregard for the truth. This quote from the SEC sums it up for me.

You must remember that it is early days in the Receivers analysis
of what CEP and Trevor Reed was up to. As I suspected that there
was not any Honest record keeping so this will take months before
the truth is revealed not that the Cultist will believe it anyway.

Therefore I will stipulate to the SEC complaint as to believe
Trevor would be ludicrous and time will prove me right.

So the first evidence of Trevors intent was that CEPs records
were incomplete or non existent

The huge difference in CEP investors between 5,000 and 16,000
was not a simple mistake

The most damming evidence was that there were NO real
"brick and mortar" investments. Many CEPers invested because
of this very prominent statement both on the website and in forums.
Trevor has had months to prove what they were so the cultist
excuses for him are very feeble.
If Trevor told this blatent of a lie how could anything else he said
not be regarded with extreme skepticism.

Trevors silence on these matters is also very damming evidence
as an innocent man would not be silent no matter what his lawyers
told him. If I was in his position and the SEC was railroading me and
I could prove what the "brick and mortar" investments were I would
be shouting it to the world.

The CEP members you are trying to convince are mostly hopeless cases
and need deprogramming. You are wasting your time talking to them.

The numerous RED FLAGS on the CEP website which were designed to
mislead have been preserved here and on the way back machine.

The evidence in TOTAL is overwhelming to those that will let themselves
see and besides putting Trevor on the stand under oath or in a room
under hot lights he will never admit to his guilt. I doubt if Trevor Reed
will even say anything more about CEP and will simply diasappear.

What was an oh so honest Christian minister to be doing in the very
slimey, sleazy world of autosurfs and HYIPs in the first place?

Trevor Reed has a hell of a lot to answer for........

As the discussion goes on:

Folks....is there any "real hard evidence" out there that Trevor was actually trying to rip anyone off (objective hard stuff here) as opposed to just goofing up in the paper work area and being a touch creative (very creative) in how he presented things to everyone and their aunt and uncle?

Hard solid stuff that speaks to hearts intent as opposed to it looks like nice overall idea that was just executed very poorly.

"REAL HARD EVIDENCE" here.....not just what we think, speculate or assume, one way or the other because it looks like this or looks like that, in relation to what might have been going on. Anything HARD that actually points to intent of heart and motive?

At this point in time it seems that his actions (as I keep hearing in various discussions with folks here) can be viewed from a number of directions from purposeful intent to deceive to just not having the business sense to properly put together all the aspects of something actually intended to help people.

Anything in his background or history that points to intent here?

I simply ask because folks are asking for more than just what it all looks like one way or the other. They are asking for Hard Evidence to be presented.......or it does stay in the realm of speculation, one way or the other, on people's parts.

Some are simply not buying the "it looks like a scam, so it must be a scam approach"....they want "intent" clarifed and verified. Even Trevors juggling of truth in being presented as just a mistake in judgement and action. The papers he signed are being explained as his way of saving money to keep it available to pay people back instead of going to lawyers and also a way to speed up the flow of the settlement and the pay back at this point, a nice thing to do on his part.

Any HARD EVIDENCE? Not just spin or speculation one way or the other.

Thanks

[mitrod3]

HonestIncome:

I appreciate the responce.

All the aspects of what you shared are concerns, observations and questions I had myself. These were also shared with others, but it really didn't go anywhere except with a few folks. In some cases even the lying seems to have been simply written off as not indicating he intended anything illegal, explained away in other ways and/or said to be motivated by good intentions overall. Also the S E C is being painted as over the top and packing it's complaint with trumped up charges to make it look strong.........:shake:

Got me. :confused:

[Linda]

In some cases even the lying seems to have been simply written off as not indicating he intended anything illegal, explained away in other ways and/or said to be motivated by good intentions overall.

mitrod3, I think you just have to realize that some of these people are totally unreachable. They don't want to be convinced. That can't hear anything you have to say. They filter everything out that doesn't agree with their flawed world-view. As others have stated, this is totally cult-like behavior. I have a feeling that Trevor could have gone out and killed someone, and many of these people would still be defending him and saying that God told him to do it and on and on. People have been doing evil things since the dawn of time and justifying it in the name of God.

[HonestIncome]

HonestIncome:

I appreciate the responce.

All the aspects of what you shared are concerns, observations and questions I had myself. These were also shared with others, but it really didn't go anywhere except with a few folks. In some cases even the lying seems to have been simply written off as not indicating he intended anything illegal, explained away in other ways and/or said to be motivated by good intentions overall.

:shake:

Got me. :confused:
There is no point in arguing with "true believers" :head: :head:
You may be able to save a few of them at best.

I forgot to say the most obvious evidence which was that CEP
claimed to able to pay 2% per day which doesn't sound that
outrageous except when you extrapolate it to 720% a year.

If Trevor took in 12 million then CEP would owe ~84 million and his
claim for making 4x this ammount would be ~336 million

Unfortuneately the level of real life intelligence is sadly lacking
in most people and they don't understand that just simple math
makes that claim utterly impossible.

If I missed other glaring examples of Trevors intent to deceive then
please add them to this thread

[HonestIncome]

As others have stated, this is totally cult-like behavior. I have a feeling that Trevor could have gone out and killed someone, and many of these people would still be defending him and saying that God told him to do it and on and on. People have been doing evil things since the dawn of time and justifying it in the name of God.
There is a very real possibility that suicide/s have/will happened over
Trevor Reeds scam whether he initially had it all planned out or not.

I would hold him responsible if this has occurred and he has RUINED
many lives by his greed and false love for money.

If Trevor Reed was who he claimed to be Trevor needs to confess all
and ask for forgiveness and not hide behind his lawyers.

Trevor E. Reed is acting like a guilty man.......

Intent doesn't mean that much to me when the consequences are so
devastating to so many.

[MatrixWatch]

Folks....is there any "real hard evidence" out there that Trevor was actually trying to rip anyone off (objective hard stuff here) as opposed to just goofing up in the paper work area and being a touch creative (very creative) in how he presented things to everyone and their aunt and uncle?

I don't think this is a fair way to frame the debate.

Take the extreme example of an armed robbery, where the clerk is shot dead. The robbers often argue that they hadn't intended to shoot anyone. The gun was purely used to threaten the clerk to hand over cash, but then something happened and the trigger was pulled.

The robber is charged with a degree of murder, simply because he deliberately created a dangerous situation that resulted in the death of a clerk.

We've shut down so many scams here at MW, that I lose track of them all. But one thing that stands out to me is how the owners of these websites assert their innocent intents when their worlds come crashing down.

And yet there was a point before the problems came when they began to realize that their system was unsustainable, and they should probably begin the refund process and "land the plane softly" (as we like to say). They didn't do this, and they instead hedged their bets, kept running the program, and made some logistical moves to soften the blows from consumer-advocacy groups & the government.

[mitrod3]

I don't think this is a fair way to frame the debate.

It may not be fair but it is the way it is being framed for me right now....and I am looking for a touch of info to stretch that frame out a bit and possibly pull some people out of the box.

Thanks to all.

[HonestIncome]

I don't think this is a fair way to frame the debate.

Take the extreme example of an armed robbery, where the clerk is shot dead. The robbers often argue that they hadn't intended to shoot anyone. The gun was purely used to threaten the clerk to hand over cash, but then something happened and the trigger was pulled.

The robber is charged with a degree of murder, simply because he deliberately created a dangerous situation that resulted in the death of a clerk.

But one thing that stands out to me is how the owners of these websites assert their innocent intents when their worlds come crashing down.
The get away car driver and others who helped plan the
robbery are also guilty by law.

I hope those accomplices like the forum Mods, Pam, Skye, HalfHitch, Layton,
etc and the main cheerleaders like 07770, Executive, MoboKing, his wife,
Honeynotvinegar, pozey, easyrider60, etc get what is coming to them

@ watchgod, mitrod3 was talking about convincing the truely brainwashed
CEP members and not what Trevor Reed was saying as he has been very
silent since the SEC filed and will probably continue by not saying a word.

PS:mitrod3 Take note that many murders and other very serious crimes are
decided by entirely circumstancial evidence.
If Trevor Reed had fought the SEC the info that would have come out in the trial
would have been overwhelming
There will be no civil trial and a criminal trial will be at least a year away so rumors
and falsehoods will prevail among the bunkered down cult true believers

[Accountant]

don't forget that an goodly portion of the Lool Aid Klub are those you mentioned above who were serious cheerleaders, made a prfoti and some of them even drew salaries from CEP, so they are at least a little worried about being dragedd into the civil and possibly the criminal case.

Anyone who got a paycheck from CEP for being a mod on a forum needs to see a lawyer about hat phrase "aware of the
truth concerning CEP and knew, or was severely reckless in not knowing" it looks to me like a pretty good hook to hang Mob, Pamela, Skye, Joy and anyone who participated in teh newscasts, certainly the last one.

[HonestIncome]

don't forget that an goodly portion of the Lool Aid Klub are those you mentioned above who were serious cheerleaders, made a prfoti and some of them even drew salaries from CEP, so they are at least a little worried about being dragedd into the civil and possibly the criminal case.

Anyone who got a paycheck from CEP for being a mod on a forum needs to see a lawyer about hat phrase "aware of the
truth concerning CEP and knew, or was severely reckless in not knowing" it looks to me like a pretty good hook to hang Mob, Pamela, Skye, Joy and anyone who participated in teh newscasts, certainly the last one.
What evidence do you have that some of them drew salaries
from CEP?
I don't think the Mods like Pamela and Skye got paid directly.
What they did get was an early position and referral / MLM
money from Monavie crapp etc
They did say that they were staff members though
MoboKing made money off his surf referral website and is why he
wants the CEP cultists at his forum
I am sure they all worked for free for their god Trevor which really
wasn't too smart as he kept them in the dark and abandoned them

Pamela, Skye and Mobo are all a little challenged if you ask me. They
can use that if they ever get up on charges.

[Accountant]

Layton mentioned somewhere a list of mods that were paid for their services, not sure about exactly who was on it but I do distintly remember one fo the girls was and am almost sure both were. I'll look for it, but there were definitly paid mods.

[Accountant]

I agree mobo is not gonna win the Nobel Prize for Physics, but he's the one I would be most conrcerned about if I didn't in fact want them all in prison. Hosting the Newscasts, expecially the one after the SEC action was filed, was almost as dumb as running a ponzi scheme on US soil and using your real name to do it.

[love]

Folks....is there any "real hard evidence" out there that Trevor was actually trying to rip anyone off

Wow, another thread totally thrown off topic by the witch-hunt...To answer your question: no, there is not any evidence to support such an accusation. The claims made by the SEC are just that, accusations, and they have not been proven.

[mitrod3]

Wow, another thread totally thrown off topic by the witch-hunt...To answer your question: no, there is not any evidence to support such an accusation. The claims made by the SEC are just that, accusations, and they have not been proven.

I would not say totally thrown off track as action(s) do often point to intent in the end..........but thank you for responce.

Your contention is that no "hard evidence" is there and that things have yet to be proven one way or the other.......

Another quick question in relation to this all.

What is your read on Trevor's and Clayton's signing off on the RECEIVER and letting C E P be liquidated? Reason behind the action?

Thanks....and again, time will tell.

[HonestIncome]

Wow, another thread totally thrown off topic by the witch-hunt...To answer your question: no, there is not any evidence to support such an accusation. The claims made by the SEC are just that, accusations, and they have not been proven.

:) i can't be bothered argueing with you my "love" ;)
So why don't you read this :p

Why don't you answer your first post about the corrupt judge?
I am not sure what you are calling "the original charge"

The Complaint consists of five (5) Counts. (http://www.moneymakergroup.com/Colon-Parenthesis-www-t26321.html&st=3210)

1. Unregistered Offer and Sale of Securities (This one is pretty easy to understand)

2. Fraud (Use of the U.S. mail system to facilitate the fraud scheme)

3. Fraud (Obtained money and property by deception. Defendants intentionally made untrue statements of material fact and intentionally omitted to state material facts necessary - Trevor claiming to have all of CEP's bases covered with respect to SEC regulations. Trevor claimed an investments in CEP was a low risk venture. Trevor claimed to have used investor funds to purchase investments in condo's, travel agencies, real estate, etc. Trevor claimed to have been conducting ongoing research into companies that were safe to invest in.

4. Fraud (Failed to communicate relevant information to investors - Trevor was using investor funds to prop up and pay on CEP auto-surf sites and was considering this as an investment, without disclosing that fact to investors)

5. Aiding and Abetting (CEP Trust was used to facilitate the fraud scheme)

CEPH had the absolute right to demand a trial, either a jury trial or a bench trial.

The majority of Civil cases are settled as opposed to having a trial. There are very few companies nationwide that are sued in Civil Court where the entire company collapses. Allegations brought forth in a Complaint are usually settled for a certain amount of money and that is the end of it. The Company continues.

In the Federal District (the Eastern District of North Carolina) where this Complaint was filed, the majority of cases where a Defendant elects to have a trial, are concluded within ONE YEAR from the date the Complaint is filed. This is not a high volume Federal District, such as New York, California, Florida, Texas or Illinois would be.

Lets dissect the counts and see what a trial would have brought:

Count I. We could all agree CEPH was guilty of Count 1. What the Defendants could have done in a trial would be to just tell the truth to the Court. That truth would be that they really did not know they were selling "securities" and that they had to register. Of course, it is not a valid legal excuse, but if this was the only violation, they would have probably gotten a fine and would have been ordered to file all the necessary documentation required with the SEC in order to continue.

Count II. This would go away if CEPH proved that the violations in Counts III, IV and V were false.

Count III. This is the big one. CEPH would have to PRESENT ACTUAL EVIDENCE that investor funds were being used to purchase what Trevor alleged. I am looking at this Complaint, and my read on it is: There are NO CONDO'S, NO TRAVEL AGENCIES, NO REAL ESTATE, NO ACTUAL INVESTMENTS IN OTHER COMPANIES, etc., and that the money was actually spent on AUTOSURFS (Notice the SEC did not refer to them as advertising companies) and HYIPS. If these hard asset items did exist, I would assume that it would not be too hard to present evidence of their actual existence. If these hard asset items do not exist, then the allegations contained in Count III of the Complaint are true.

Count IV. If Trevor was funneling CEP investor funds into CEP autosurfs, other autosurfs and HYIPS, (the SEC takes the stance that just because a site calls themselves an advertising site, does not necessarily mean it is one. The SEC considers most on-line sites which call themselves "advertising sites" to actually be autosurf sites.) then the allegations contained in Count IV of the Complaint are true.

Count V. This would go away if CEPH proved that the violations in Counts III, IV and V were false.

So, CEPH has three options:

1. File a formal ANSWER to the Complaint and agree with all of the allegations alleged.

2. File a formal ANSWER to the Complaint, with a jury demand for a trial, deny all of the allegations and move the case for trial.

3. Avoid filing a formal ANSWER and just give the SEC everything they are asking for in the Complaint by way of a Consent Order.

Given the severity of this case:

If CEPH elected option 1 and just agreed with all of the allegations the SEC alleged, if criminal charges were filed down the line, these admissions would be used against CEPH as an admission of guilt.

If CEPH elected option 2 and opted for a trial so that they could "have their day in court" so that they could prove that the allegations in the Complaint filed by the SEC were false, and that as a result of this trial, the preponderance of the evidence was most favorable to the CEPH (meaning they produced evidence of actual investments), a ruling would be made in favor of CEPH and against the SEC. If on the other hand, the preponderance of the evidence was most favorable to the SEC, a ruling would be made in favor of the SEC and against CEPH. Here again, if the SEC is the winner, this would greatly benefit the Department of Justice if a criminal case is later filed.

If CEPH elected option 3 to just give the SEC everything they were asking for, by way of a Consent Order, and thus not being required to formally Answer the Complaint, the entire company gets placed in the hands of a Receiver. It is at this point that Trevor and Clayton no longer own these companies and have no say what so ever in anything CEPH related. They are not allowed to defend themselves against these CIVIL charges at this point. They gave up that right when they signed the Consent Order. They gave the company up. This Receiver will reconstruct all the financial data, determine who will and, who will not, receive any monies left over after everything is liquidated. After the Civil side is concluded the case gets reviewed by the DOJ and they decide if they will file criminal charges.

I guess, everyone just has to ask themselves one simple question: If you were truly innocent of these allegations, what Option would you take?

[Accountant]

Wow, another thread totally thrown off topic by the witch-hunt...To answer your question: no, there is not any evidence to support such an accusation. The claims made by the SEC are just that, accusations, and they have not been proven.

They have not been contested by Trevor or Clayton when they had the chance, so I'd say they were admitted to.

[concerned]

To answer your question: no, there is not any evidence to support such an accusation. The claims made by the SEC are just that, accusations, and they have not been proven.

Ummmm, I have some pretty Hard Evidence, that I don't think you even considered. How about the signatures of Trevor and Clayton on the SEC documents ADMITTING that the did what they were accused of doing? Furthermore, those documents allow the SEC to undo all the illegal mess they made, and try to make it right to all the investors.

[mitrod3]

One take being floated here seems to be that Trevor and Clayton are actually innocent of the trumped up charges concocted by the S E C. They apparently signed off on the Consent Decree not as an admission of guilt, but out of real concern that C E P folks get paid back quickly from the founds they currently do have on hand, safe and sound. Those funds will cover everyone's initial investment. Trevor and Clayton apparently sacrificed their reputations (being innocent) to do the right, just and decnt thing for the C E P investors out there.

:shake:

Some are really buying into this as we all have the right to believe as we choose. I guess I still just see it different with concepts like spin and denial coming into the picture here.

[MatrixWatch]

They apparently signed off on the Consent Decree not as an admission of guilt, but out of real concern that C E P folks get paid back quickly...

Oh, yes. Of course...

[sisco50]

Wow, another thread totally thrown off topic by the witch-hunt...To answer your question: no, there is not any evidence to support such an accusation. The claims made by the SEC are just that, accusations, and they have not been proven.

Not proven? The accusations were admitted to though by the two perbs, but I quess that is not solid enough!

The washing ran very deep on some. I venture to say that some will never be normal again if they ever were to start with. :(

[concerned]

One take being floated here seems to be that Trevor and Clayton are actually innocent of the trumped up charges concocted by the S E C. They apparently signed off on the Consent Decree not as an admission of guilt, but out of real concern that C E P folks get paid back quickly from the founds they currently do have on hand, safe and sound. Those funds will cover everyone's initial investment. Trevor and Clayton apparently sacrificed their reputations (being innocent) to do the right, just and decnt thing for the C E P investors out there.

:shake:

Some are really buying into this as we all have the right to believe as we choose. I guess I still just see it different with concepts like spin and denial coming into the picture here.


Too bad they didn't just DO THE RIGHT THING by investing the money in a way that made people money instead of running a scam behind false promises and lies amung other things. But what groses me out the most, is they ran their scam behind the name of God. What cowards, and hypocrits. They used God's name while doing everything opposite of how God wanted people to live. In fact look at the comandments, and let's see how many they broke.

1. Thou shalt not have strange gods before me. Thou shalt not make to thyself any graven thing.


I think it's a stretch, but I would consider a God that allows someone to steel in their name to be a strange god.

Also, the word graven means, to impress deeply: graven on the mind.

They did impress deeply into pepople's minds that they were God's gift to finances, so I will say they broke this comandment.


2. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.


Can't take the lord's name in any more vein than using to to scam others. I say broken.


3. Remember that thou keep holy the Lord's day.


I am sure they were scamming on sundays, or at least telling their lies on sundays, so I say broken.


4. Honor thy father and thy mother.


Well, I can't speak on behalf of their parents, so I am going to give them the benefit of the doubt that their parents are really proud of them scamming other people, so I will concede this one by saying if their parents approve of them scamming, they must have honored them.


5. Thou shalt not kill.


Does people commiting suicide count as an indirect kill? If so, then I hope nobody did this over the depression they were put under, so I will say maybe for now.


6. Thou shalt not commit adultery.


Well, they sure f**ked a whole lot of people, but I don't know if that's what this means. Also, I can't speak for them on this, cause we just don't know what happens behind both doors. I will say maybe.


7. Thou shalt not steal.


This one's a no brainer. BROKEN.


8. Thou shalt not bear false witness.


Another no Brainer. BROKEN


9. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.


I will give the benefit of the doubt and just say not broken.


10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's goods.


I'm sure they have most of the neighbor's money, so I say BROKEN.


So, according to my math, which is the exact opposite of CEP math, which means my math is right, the score is:

BROKEN COMANDMENTS: 6

MAYBE BROKEN:2

NOT BROKEN: 2

[fallenrock]

Hello,

I have tried and tried to login to coastin88 and cep trust for over
a week now and can't get in. I keep getting the message: Failure
to connect to web server. Is anyone else having that problem?
I have put money into this one too.

Sincerely,

Kathy

[concerned]

Hello,

I have tried and tried to login to coastin88 and cep trust for over
a week now and can't get in. I keep getting the message: Failure
to connect to web server. Is anyone else having that problem?
I have put money into this one too.

Sincerely,

Kathy

The SEC confiscated the servers and shut them down cause they were running a scam. You can read up on it more on this site.

[fallenrock]

Thank you concerned for answering my question so quickly.
I was really beating my head against a wall trying to understand
why I couldn't login.

Sincerely,

Kathy

[concerned]

Yeah, I think every CEP site was shut down cause even though they said they were all seperate, they were all connected.

[fallenrock]

Is this going to be permanent? What I mean is are they proven
to be a total scam? This is the second religious-based program
that I have been involved with. I lost so much money with the
last one. And now this. Is there anything out there that is
legitimate, I wonder?

Sincerely,

Kathy

[MatrixWatch]

Fool me twice... :)

[mitrod3]

Is this going to be permanent? What I mean is are they proven to be a total scam? This is the second religious-based program
that I have been involved with. I lost so much money with the last one. And now this. Is there anything out there that is legitimate, I wonder?
Sincerely,
Kathy

Permanent? Yep. Trevor and Clayton signed off on a Consent Decree to allow C E P to be liquidated.

I guess someone else could take off with Trevors core concepts and come back, at least for awhile. But, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is, unless you get in and get out on the front end without regard for those who will clobbered on the back end.

[concerned]

Is this going to be permanent?

Of course it is permanent. Why would the SEC let a scam come back?

What I mean is are they proven
to be a total scam?

They admitted it was.

This is the second religious-based program
that I have been involved with.

Religion and finance don't mix. You should never do anything just cause someone says they are relogeous. You should invest money in a program cause someone is a financial genious, not a certain religion. Would you eat at a resturant that had a rat sitting next to you if you knew a preist owned it?

I lost so much money with the
last one.

So, why did you do it again?

And now this. Is there anything out there that is
legitimate, I wonder?

Getting a job is legitimate. So is the stock market, mutual funds, Bonds, etc. The key is to use someone that knows what they are doing. Make sure they have a CFA, Series 7, MBA, a license to do investments, etc.

[nomore]

Yes, permanent, gone..... They confessed to it being a fraud. They confessed to being guilty, it is over and done with forever. Several people will probably see jail time. Most will never see a penny back, some will even have to PAY MONEY BACK! For it was not only a scam and illegal, so were the people in pofit breaking the law. Justice was done, a criminal is going to be brought to justice.
A very EVIL MAN..... TREVOR REED:flame:

[fallenrock]

You know I feel like such an idiot for falling for something
like this again. I agree, Trevor is going to get his just desserts.
He really is an evil man. Once again I think of all the people along
with me that were lured right in by smooth talking vulture. I am sure
grateful that I decided to come in here and find out this information.
I thank everyone for their input on this matter.

Kathy

[mitrod3]

Religion and finance don't mix.

Oh my, does that one ever strike home as C E P was mainly promoted through religious connections in this area. The location (charismatic fellowship) that it started out from is now getting a bit of a bad rap for promoting:

"prophecy for profit" and/or "prophets for profits".......

when it was actually and initially hoped that people could just make extra money to help out with very some worthwhile concerns and focuses.

[Consumingfire]

Too bad they didn't just DO THE RIGHT THING by investing the money in a way that made people money instead of running a scam behind false promises and lies amung other things. But what groses me out the most, is they ran their scam behind the name of God. What cowards, and hypocrits. They used God's name while doing everything opposite of how God wanted people to live. In fact look at the comandments, and let's see how many they broke.

1. Thou shalt not have strange gods before me. Thou shalt not make to thyself any graven thing.


I think it's a stretch, but I would consider a God that allows someone to steel in their name to be a strange god.

Also, the word graven means, to impress deeply: graven on the mind.

They did impress deeply into pepople's minds that they were God's gift to finances, so I will say they broke this comandment.


2. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.


Can't take the lord's name in any more vein than using to to scam others. I say broken.


3. Remember that thou keep holy the Lord's day.


I am sure they were scamming on sundays, or at least telling their lies on sundays, so I say broken.


4. Honor thy father and thy mother.


Well, I can't speak on behalf of their parents, so I am going to give them the benefit of the doubt that their parents are really proud of them scamming other people, so I will concede this one by saying if their parents approve of them scamming, they must have honored them.


5. Thou shalt not kill.


Does people commiting suicide count as an indirect kill? If so, then I hope nobody did this over the depression they were put under, so I will say maybe for now.


6. Thou shalt not commit adultery.


Well, they sure f**ked a whole lot of people, but I don't know if that's what this means. Also, I can't speak for them on this, cause we just don't know what happens behind both doors. I will say maybe.


7. Thou shalt not steal.


This one's a no brainer. BROKEN.


8. Thou shalt not bear false witness.


Another no Brainer. BROKEN


9. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.


I will give the benefit of the doubt and just say not broken.


10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's goods.


I'm sure they have most of the neighbor's money, so I say BROKEN.


So, according to my math, which is the exact opposite of CEP math, which means my math is right, the score is:

BROKEN COMANDMENTS: 6

MAYBE BROKEN:2

NOT BROKEN: 2

No one can keep the Law thats why were saved through Jesus.
The Law (10 Commandments ) shows us how sinful we all are..even you Concerned.:crazy:

[Consumingfire]

Yes, permanent, gone..... They confessed to it being a fraud. They confessed to being guilty, it is over and done with forever. Several people will probably see jail time. Most will never see a penny back, some will even have to PAY MONEY BACK! For it was not only a scam and illegal, so were the people in pofit breaking the law. Justice was done, a criminal is going to be brought to justice.
A very EVIL MAN..... TREVOR REED:flame:

Everyone's heart is Evil and wicked, didn't you know that?

[mitrod3]

Consumingfire:

A slight catch in the works here.

True, we all fall short.....but that does not give us the excuse to just rip people off because it is simply "our nature" and ever so easy to give into that nature while not taking a stand for what is anywhere close to "right" before God and man.

And sorry, not all the folks I hang with are in the "evil" category. Some actually do care about others, and their words and actions show it.

But hey......I can't speak for those you run with. Maybe they all are just flat out evil and don't care a wit about others. You might consider picking better friends to hang with if that is the case.

[concerned]

No one can keep the Law thats why were saved through Jesus.
The Law (10 Commandments ) shows us how sinful we all are..even you Concerned.:crazy:

You know what? You are right. Why am I trying to be a good law obiding citizen? I have made up my mind. I will start scamming people since I don't have to follow laws or the commandments.. I will start with you. Send me all your money so I can start my scamming ways.

[Consumingfire]

What's the difference between Gambling at the Casino or in MLM/investment/surf Schemes?

Nothing really, if you're dumb enough to go bet on a race then you deserve to loose that money. Same goes for people who risk their money on online programs.
Why waste your time trying to monitor them??
You'll end up doing this after awhile:head: i know I do.

[Consumingfire]

You know what? You are right. Why am I trying to be a good law obiding citizen? I have made up my mind. I will start scamming people since I don't have to follow laws or the commandments.. I will start with you. Send me all your money so I can start my scamming ways.


You missed my point.
You are judging (Them) by the Law which inturn judges you.:rolleyes:

[mitrod3]

You missed my point. You are judging (Them) by the Law which inturn judges you.:rolleyes:

I guess I will stand judged then and not just let manipulation and abuse :nono: (if that is the case) go without a challenge and without speaking up about what I see, sense and hear.

If the darn thing is a duck, well, call it a duck and then let the chips fall where they may. At least the "duck" observation/warning is out there for whoever to grab onto or ignore.

[concerned]

You missed my point.
You are judging (Them) by the Law which inturn judges you.:rolleyes:

First of all, where does it say Thou shall not judge others?

Next, if I am judging someone that is scamming people and casting judgement on that person in order to protect people, then I believe when the time comes for me to be judged by the "greater being" they will take into consideration that I was really doing good. Why would god or whoever say, well, you stoped thousands of people from being scammed, and you put bad people in jail, but since you judged them, you can't go to heaven. Well, I will tell you this. If that's how I will be judged, then I probably don't want to be in heaven. After all, there can't be any fun up there if there are no booz or sex.

[Accountant]

What's the difference between Gambling at the Casino or in MLM/investment/surf Schemes?

Nothing really, if you're dumb enough to go bet on a race then you deserve to loose that money. Same goes for people who risk their money on online programs.
Why waste your time trying to monitor them??
You'll end up doing this after awhile:head: i know I do.

At the track they pay the winners and peole are there to make sure they follow the rules. In HYIPs, they only pay the ones they want to pay and only as much as they want to pay, and no one is making sure they do. Oh, and they're lying to you, telling yo they have real investments. At the track, I can see the horse.

[concerned]

What's the difference between Gambling at the Casino or in MLM/investment/surf Schemes?

Nothing really, if you're dumb enough to go bet on a race then you deserve to loose that money. Same goes for people who risk their money on online programs.
Why waste your time trying to monitor them??
You'll end up doing this after awhile:head: i know I do.

What's the difference?

Gambling at a casino or Race Track has the following features:

- Gambling is regulated by the government! So is investing. The difference is HYIPs don't follow the regulations, cause they can't follow the rules due to the way they are designed

- The odds of winning/losing is posted at all gambling machines, tables, etc. HYIP and other Scams tell people there is little to no risk, with outrageous and imposible returns.

- When I walk into a casino in the afternoon, and 3000 people walked in before me, I don't have to wait for those 3000 people to win before I have a chance to win. We all have the SAME odds. With a scheme, I can't see who's pulling the strings behind the curtain.

- The casino owner isn't hiding in a foreign country like a scammer.

- The casino's don't lie. They don't have to. They still make money even though they tell you the truth. What would happen in a scheme if they told the truth?

- If I win at a casino, they pay me right away. If I win at a scheme, who knows when I will get paid, or if I will get paid.

- If I win at a casino, I don't have to put a percentage back if I don't want to. In a scheme, sometimes they make you auto reinvest.

- In a casino, I never have pretend money that I have to wait to get later.

- Casinos are usually required to fund programs to help problem gamblers if they get our of hand. What do HYIP and other schemes do to help people with a problem investing in bad HYIPs?

- Most importantly, casinos follow the laws, schemes don't.