A website of interest

[brokepoker]

This link should interest the people here. It is a fascinating read on the life of Charles Ponzi.

http://www.mark-knutson.com/

Someone in another post was asking why don't the matrix owners keep all of the first spots for themselves? The answer is that the first people in the matrix who actually get their merchandise are crucial to the scheme working. They are the ones who go out and tell their friends "HEY LOOK!" I got this plasma TV for $100.00. Then their friends thinking it must be legit go and tell all of their other friends. In essence it is the most powerful advertising mechinisms available. Greed and Word of Mouth.

People actually rioted because so many became involved in Ponzi's scheme which worked in a very similar way. It gave interest on the money instead of a playstation 2 but still the same idea.

Check it out...it is true..history is doomed to repeat itself.


And just like in Ponzi's day, there were people sticking up for him and saying it would work until the bitter end. There were even copycats trying to imitate his investment scheme.

Funny..or sad..or both?!

:confused:

[Arzel]

Not really sad, not really funny, but yet a little of both. What is interesting is how history plays out over and over again. The same scam and schemes come back all of the time, maybe with a slightly different name or reasoning, but basically the same.

The Ponzi read is very interesting, as is the colapse of the whole finacial economy of the eastern European country of Albania in 1997.

Read the following link as well.

http://www.worldbank.org/transitionnewsletter/janfeb00/pgs24-26.htm

What is really interesting to me is how the Matrix got it's name in the first place. Anyone with an advanced knowledge of math would find the word matrix to describe the concept by which they work somewhat amusing.

[MatrixWatch]

Arzel and Brokepoker, I am VERY impressed with your knowledge of the matrix sites. You guys seem to have more knowledge on this subject than you have revealed so far. Guys, please tell the Matrix Watch community some more. You have some good stuff. If we could get a thread going on how Ponzi is ghostly similar to today's matrix sites, and another thread on the mathematical consequences of the matrix concept, then that would be a great asset to our site. One that would really help the newcomers to make better decisions about joining a matrix site. Thanks for your involvement guys, I really appreciate it.

[dbright]

What I don't understand is why the FTC hasn't stepped in on these matrix sites already. The idea that these matrix sites actally try to hide this pyramid scheme behind the sale of worthless...and that's what they are....worthless e-books doesn't change the fact that it is a pyramid scheme. Perhaps they haven't yet recieved enough complaints or actually looked at what these e-books are worth VS. what they are actually being sold for with a "free entry into a matrix". A freind of mine who had stupidy joined EZexpo showed me these "ebooks". You can find this garbage for free on the internet if you just look or even just a few dollars on ebay. None of these matrix sites sell any information worth more that $5.00....and please any suppoters don't tell me it's worth what the matrix sites sell it for......if you can find it for free or just a few dollars, then that is ALL it is worth...no argument. There are quite a few articles on the FTC site that deal with this type of deception. This is a direct lift on one of those articles about what to watch out for in dealing with any business or investment:

"3. If a plan purports to sell a product or service, check to see whether its price is inflated, whether new members must buy costly inventory, or whether members make most "sales" to other members rather than the general public. If any of these conditions exist, the purported "sale" of the product or service may just mask a pyramid scheme that promotes an endless chain of recruiting and inventory loading. "

There was even a statement in one of those FTC articles that even mentioned lawsuits and how half the plantiffs that show up in court want restitution from the "company" and the other half of the plantiffs defend the company to the end.....still hoping to get rich from these pyramid schemes. If you look on the EZexpo matrix forum you see just that kind of behavior....very sad in my opinion. You'll never see any of the die hard supporters actally admit to the true mathematics of the operation...90% of those people will never recieve anything (except a worthless ebook)...they're just hoping to make it to the top. ...and NO AMOUNT of advertising will ever get everyone cycled.

This is one of the few times I wish the government would step in before too many good people become victims.

[Arzel]

I agree completely.

Part of the problem probably stems from the fact that the FTC just doesn't have the resources to go after these schemes on their own. They probably don't even hear about them until people start losing their money and complaining about them.

You make a very interesting point about people defending the matrix or pryamid until the very end, still hoping to get rich, and I was thinking about this last night.

One of the most interesting social natures of us as humans is what is called "Mob Behavior". Anyone that has seen or experienced such an experience is amazed at how quickly a rational individual will act upon the basic nature of a human being, the feeling of being left out, or losing to another. Individual people involved in a mob would for the most part never think of just taking stuff from a store, but as soon as a few people start, everyone starts doing it. The whole "If they can do it, why can't I?" attitude. While in the mob, very few in the mob feel they are doing anything wrong.

The matrix world is very similar. It is a very destructive behavior because it accelerates entropy, which is the move from an organized state to a disorganized state. Our whole society is based off organization, moving from a disorganized state to an organized state, and is the basis for our economy (organization creates product, which creates wealth, which stimulates more organization). The matrix creates no wealth, only redistributes it, and at the same time some of the wealth leaves the matrix creating disorganization (entropy). This requires the rest of us to work harder to fix the imbalance in entropy.

People in the matrix just don't realize that the matrix causes problems outside of the matrix, because they are part of the mob.

Sorry about the weird anallogy, but sometimes the weird connection makes the most sense.

[dbright]

You're right about the FTC not having the resources Azrel. Actually I don't think anyone has actally reported to the FTC in large numbers that these matrix sites are actually pyramid schemes...and they are pyramid schemes because they sell a product VS. a ponzi scheme which pretends to be an investment. The matrix site owners know this....you should read the EZexpo matrix forum...that's all the "defenders of the faith" keep bringing up any time someone complains about the site and how long it looks like it's going to take to get their free gift...."you bought an E-book....be happy with that"....of course there were quite a few people who managed to get in early and still came right out and said in the forum that the ebooks were worthless.

And after reading that forum, I get the distinct impression by the grammer and general attitude of the posters that most of them are late teens, early 20's at the most, hense the very quick and often rude defense of the site.

The real test of the legality of the matrix site:

If the site owners couldn't sell their ebook or whatever product they're promoting at the current posted prices without offering a gift in a matrix then by definition it is a pyramid scheme.

EZexpo is just that...case in point: when someone signed up for a $25.00 PS2 matrix or a $220 plasma matrix they both recieved the SAME ebook. After the site first opened I also saw this directly on their forum. That clearly made it a pyramid scheme...the same "product" but wildly different prices depending on which matrix you signed up for.......How stupid would you have to be to defend this type of nonsense unless you were hoping for a payout for yourself and didn't want anyone to "mess it up for you"...clearly the attitude of these people (or should I say kids).

None of them really want to admit that eventually the whole thing is going to collapse.

I saw the post by Shelby asking what it would take to drop the lawsuit...I hope the answer was to refund everyone's money and shut down the site. If this lawsuit doesn't do it then eventually the government will.....as long as people report it for what it is...ILLEGAL